US Politics Thread 2016-2020

[Rockstar]

[Buddahaid]

That's helpful. Seriously, the FBI's recommendation was that a case could not be effectively built from the evidence. Opinions are just that, opinions, not proofs.

[Von Due]

Just some food for thoughts
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-42031670

Now, it may be easy to latch onto the side story here, the accusations, but one might want to have a sit down and think-through on the main story: Tribalism and how it shapes the political landscape, how the voters shape the landscape.

[Catfish]

^ a threatening idea.. but it explains a lot for all sides.

We are animals organised in tribes. Monkeys with high speed digital fibre optic technology, but still just tribes. Monkeys that hate.

[u crank]

Originally Posted by Catfish

We are animals organised in tribes. Monkeys with high speed digital fibre optic technology, but still just tribes. Monkeys that hate.

You got that right man. Well said.

Originally Posted by Von Due

Just some food for thoughts
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-42031670

Good find. This caught my eye.

In the context of Donald Trump, political scientists have recently discovered that voters aren't stupid - they are actually quite capable of recognising that a politician is lying. But it doesn't change the way they feel about him.

It seems to me that in America and other places as well, voters are put in a position that they don't want to be in. To make a choice that they don't want to make. It's an imperfect system that's not likely to change.

In Moore's case there is a lot a stake. If Jones, the Democrat wins, and he is ahead in the polls, the GOP advantage in the Senate goes down to one. With John McCain and Rand Paul that is big trouble for the GOP.

[Rockstar]

Am I now to think the truth is that Gorillas must hate Orangutans because the Gorilla would rather live within its own borders with other Gorillas? Or would it be better to say the two beasts know how to *live and let live?


*you should tolerate the opinions and behavior of others so that they will similarly tolerate your own

[Catfish]

^ not a problem when these live in Africa, and those in Borneo

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Catfish

^ not a problem when these live in Africa, and those in Borneo

[vienna]

Originally Posted by August

Well I listened to the whole thing live but the funny thing is that the statute does not mention intent.





https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/793

In criminal law, intent is a part of the whole basis for prosecution along with means, and opportunity, etc.; it is not necessary for a statute to explicitly state intent as part of a violation. Basically, any criminal case has to have the component of intent in order to be prosecutable and, ultimately, for a finding of guilt...


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intention_(criminal_law)


The need to how intent is what keeps a person who accidentally or unintentionally causes a harm from being prosecuted and convicted harshly by an extreme application of a law; this is the fundamental criteria that defines the difference between 1st degree murder and involuntary manslaughter; without the proof of intent, every person who took a life, even accidentally, would be open to a 1st degree murder charge...






<O>

[Dowly]

Michael Flynn pleads guilty to lying to the FBI

Former national security adviser Michael Flynn pleaded guilty Friday to lying to the FBI about his contacts with Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak, and authorities indicated in court he was acting under instructions from senior Trump transition officials in his dealings with the diplomat.

[Mr Quatro]

Pleaded guilty with a deal I betcha ...

I bet you ... (in case Steve is reading this thread)

[August]

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

Pleaded guilty with a deal I betcha ...

I bet you ... (in case Steve is reading this thread)

What do you want to bet that this does not affect the president?

[vienna]

Sucker bet for you...

The news reports regarding the Flynn deal have made mention of Flynn having acted at the direct behest of Trump on some of the matters at issue, not a good prospect for Ol' Yellow Hair, if proved; the fact that Flynn got such a light deal considering all the other charges he could have faced indicates whatever cooperation and information he has been sharing with the Special Counsel is/was worth the price, somewhat similar to the break John Dean got in the Watergate scandal. I still have a strong suspicion Flynn and the others involved with contacts with Russia were acting on a belief their contacts were secure and out of the sight and purview of the FBI, NSA, etc. when they really weren't; Flynn, Manafort, and a couple of the other actors seemed to be genuinely shocked and surprised when the details of the when, where, and who of the contacts were revealed. It will be interesting to see what shakes out now...


The good, the bad and the ugly of Michael Flynn's guilty plea --

http://thehill.com/opinion/judiciary...ynn-indictment








<O>

[vienna]

“Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the president or any other public official, save exactly to the degree in which he himself stands by the country. It is patriotic to support him insofar as he efficiently serves the country. It is unpatriotic not to oppose him to the exact extent that by inefficiency or otherwise he fails in his duty to stand by the country. In either event, it is unpatriotic not to tell the truth, whether about the president or anyone else.”

― Theodore Roosevelt






Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.

― Mark Twain










<O>

[Platapus]

To paraphrase Mark Twain

When the Trump administration calls role at a meeting, the attendees don't know whether to answer "present" or "not guilty".