Calculating AOB with OLC Gold

[Hitman]

....and anyway the real exact dimensions of the ship were rarely known before the attack. Kaleuns had lots of practice in estimating target's length, heigth and also tonnage, plus getting under 1000 metres as they did whenever possible also reduced chances of missing it.

Oh, and another important thing: Real Kaleuns also missed shots, you know...

[makman94]

Originally Posted by tmdgm

oh yeah, the glanville freighter. that was wayy off. this may be a dumb question, but how do you set a mission up with that specific ship? i'm guessing there's a mission editor somewhere?

check in a minute my ff page.i will upload for you the mission i had use for the correction of the Granville freighter.play first the mission with the old values and then play it with the fixed ones(do what i told you at the post at sh3 mods workshop) and you will see how lovely this game can be!(PLEASE RUN ALSO THE GWX-ship bayoncy and draught mod by Rubini)

Originally Posted by onelifecrisis

I dunno about the mission but yeah, Granville used to be way off, along with the Empire Type Freighter. I assumed that those two, at least, would be fixed in GWX3 because their innacuracies were widely reported... but I've not checked them.

makman, if you say there are very many innacuracies then I believe you. I've never manually checked the ships in a modelling program. But I'd suggest that most of the discrepancies make little actual difference to... well, to anything. I said the ships measurements are mostly accurate because while playing (even in GWX 2.1) my experience was that most ships had data which was accurate enough to get a firing solution. There were exceptions (such as the two ships mentioned above) but generally I managed to hit my targets. Having said that, I would still love to see any inaccuracies corrected! But checking all the ships is a big job.

OLC, yes i agree with you that most of them are playable BUT i don't think that if i done everything right and get an aob of +-15 degrees is something that someone realy likes! most of the values are so so well ,at most of the ships the higher spot is something that is 'pixeling'....meaning showing and hiding and at last you don't even know ...what part of the ship had measure the person who had set these values for masts! the lengths are... out of discusion!they are from another planet...(Averoffs correct length is 185 and now is setted at 140)
I can't agree more with you how painfull this job is.you can't imagine how many hours i had spent for this subject but i can tell you ,for sure , this:if you play the game with the correct values you will simply....love it (aob's acuracy ,if you are very carefull can reach +-2 degrees)! i call everybody who really loves this game to start fixing all of them! not only gwx's ships but wac's also and nygm's too (i haven't play nygm and i don't know if it containes other ships than stock)
i will tell you what i do (suggestion) .i will start a new thread ,and i will write there the ships i had correct till now (in these corrections a had mark at .sils the spots of ship that had measured...like the .sil i had post at post 3 ,so everybody will know what part of ship to measure.sometimes is better to measure the funnel...like the medium cargo)
in that thread everybody who had a 'meet' with a 'problematic' ship can post his corrections.eventually some day all the ships will be fixed ....just hope this thread not to ....sink!

Originally Posted by Hitman

....and anyway the real exact dimensions of the ship were rarely known before the attack. Kaleuns had lots of practice in estimating target's length, heigth and also tonnage, plus getting under 1000 metres as they did whenever possible also reduced chances of missing it.

Oh, and another important thing: Real Kaleuns also missed shots, you know...

i really like a correct recognition manual Hitman.the game itselfs will make it difficult to had a good shot becuase the weather situations(where is the...waterline ...the mast is poping up and down...etc), day -night visibilities and tensions in battle are making harder to get your measurments...so inacuracy is always there! but imagine how useless it gets if you plus to all these an untrusted recogninion manual

Originally Posted by Pisces

Besides that, who said the Lloyds Register didn't have any mistakes in thier records.

[Pisces]

Originally Posted by harryt8

Pisces,

Can you advise me where I can download a plain chronograph similar to the chrono used by Friedl9te's video on OLC attach solution?

Thank.

Harryt8

Allright I did some deep digging in old threads and found something you probalby meant. But it isn't a video by Friedl9te. It's a walkthrough showing the stopwatch you want (or so I understand).

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...&postcount=207

Here is the post with a link to the file. But it is a rapidshare link, and it is dead now. Your best bet in getting it is asking Freidl9te by private message.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...&postcount=169

[harryt8]

Pisces,

Thank you for the time and trouble you have gone to research this.
Yes, it was a "step-through" on the OLC attack routine.
I found it useful.
Again, thanks.

Harry

[onelifecrisis]

Originally Posted by makman94

i will tell you what i do (suggestion) .i will start a new thread ,and i will write there the ships i had correct till now (in these corrections a had mark at .sils the spots of ship that had measured...like the .sil i had post at post 3 ,so everybody will know what part of ship to measure.sometimes is better to measure the funnel...like the medium cargo)
in that thread everybody who had a 'meet' with a 'problematic' ship can post his corrections.eventually some day all the ships will be fixed ....just hope this thread not to ....sink!

Excellent idea IMO. I'd suggest sticking to the actual mast height rather than using things like funnels for measuring, to avoid any confusion. May I also suggest you make it clear in your OP that several popular mods may affect mast heights. I'm not certain, but mods such as Lifeboats & Debris, Thomsen's Ships, STz's Sinking Ships Fix and others may affect how deep each ship sits in the water (which in turn affects mast height of course) and that's without even starting to think about mods such as the Community Units mod. People may get quite different results from the same ships depending on their setups.

[makman94]

Originally Posted by onelifecrisis

Excellent idea IMO. I'd suggest sticking to the actual mast height rather than using things like funnels for measuring, to avoid any confusion. May I also suggest you make it clear in your OP that several popular mods may affect mast heights. I'm not certain, but mods such as Lifeboats & Debris, Thomsen's Ships, STz's Sinking Ships Fix and others may affect how deep each ship sits in the water (which in turn affects mast height of course) and that's without even starting to think about mods such as the Community Units mod. People may get quite different results from the same ships depending on their setups.

yes,that is a good point OLC ! i know for sure that ''GWX_ships_Buoyance&draught_mod'' is effecting the height of the ship that is above water (Rubini had told me that the small ships are about 0.5m deeper,the big about 0.8m and the real big till 1.2m). can anyone ,who is familiar with these type of mods, (i personally have no idea) to confirm which ones of the popular mods are effecting the height ?
ps1: Thomsen's Ships mod is out of discussion becuase a lot of issues with this mod are not sorted yet
ps2: @olc: about funnels or masts : there will be no confuse at all becuase once you recognise the ship it will be shown to you (at the .sil)what part of it to measure. in some cases,like the medium cargo, is much more visible the funnel and its just a little bit lower of its highest part

[onelifecrisis]

Wow, the problem is much worse than I thought. I took a look at the Lifeboats & Debris mod and it completely buggers all of the mast values. I can't believe I only just found out about this. No wonder so many people get screwy calculations, when mine are always accurate.

[makman94]

Originally Posted by onelifecrisis

Wow, the problem is much worse than I thought. I took a look at the Lifeboats & Debris mod and it completely buggers all of the mast values. I can't believe I only just found out about this. No wonder so many people get screwy calculations, when mine are always accurate.

Note to All
Sorry, but unless/until makman's project to find corrected mast values for the L&D mod is completed you should consider OLC Gold and Lifeboats and Debris to be incompatible.

Actually, **** it, I'll make a proper announcement...

i have the immersion that only the ''GWX_ships_Buoyance&draught_mod'' witch is incuded in the optional files of Lifeboats and Debris mod is effecting the heights. as Rubini describes in the read me only this is effecting the heights.it containes only .sim files (the l+b mod containes .val files but i don't know if these files are effecting the height )
Rubini never mentioned to me (or at his readme for l+b mod) that .val files are effecting the height.
i think that the better is Rubini to confirm that.better pm him
edit:and something else, the ''GWX_ships_Buoyance&draught_mod'' put just a little bit the ships deeper in water. as Rubini told me the light ships are about 0,5m deeper ,the big at about 0,8m and the real big about 1,2m so the harm is not so scary! (that doesnot mean by anyway that must not be fixed ) the problem is at some of the first mast values.
also the rubini's mod is not effecting the LENGTHS of ships.at my first adjustments '' ships1-gwx3'' you will notice that the southampton class had length=180 and the correct is length=169
averoffs length is 140 and the correct is 185,chatham-type troop ship is 167 and the correct is 140 (and others....) so you can't be acurate with these ships even if you use rubini's mod even not
bye

[onelifecrisis]

Hmm, right you are. I thought it was in the .val files but it's actually in the .sim files.

I've edited the announcement post.