KTB of a Green Kaleun (Bernard)

Sophist · 06-04-17, 12:54 AM

(TLDR: Interesting part at ***)

Informal KTB of U-46, Leutnant z. s. Sophist

I made this Subsim account some time ago, hoping to put in some good hours into SI3 and post some interesting stories. Life got busy, and I was unable to do so. Here I am, after a bit of lurking on the forums, with a little story of a debacle that I thought might be funny to the old salts.

I put in a few dozen hours (~40) into the vanilla career. I figured out, slowly, how to mount an effective attack under decent conditions and eased myself off the training wheels. I figured I was pretty decent at the vanilla game; let's try this GWX thing I've heard so much about.

I start off a career in 1940, around the time I left off my vanilla career. Right off I'm impressed by the depth of GWX. I skim the recognition manual as my type VIIB slowly floats out of Lorient. BdU sends me somewhere around CF33. I patrolled for about 24 hours with no sightings. Then word comes in: large convoy sighted near CG11 headed NNW slow.

Now, bear in mind. I had, to this point, never engaged a convoy - neither in vanilla nor GWX. I get quite intimidated by the nasty frigate and corvette escorts. I unsuccessfully shadow the convoy and get spotted several times. I lost contact when some air patrols force me under 200 km off Cornwall. [REDACTED; no offense intended].

After some time, report comes in of another convoy, this one outbound west. I decide on a new strategy: get visual contact, estimate the course, then dip around and wait way out front. I do so, sitting quietly under the waves, and soon I'm getting sound contacts all over the place. I wait, real patiently, while the sound contacts get closer and the contact I figure must be the lead frigate passes on by. It looks like I'm at the southern edge of the westbound convoy. It's deep night at this point, so I raise my periscope cautiously to take a look around.

The waves are massive and I can see nothing but torrential rain, frothing waters, and darkness. My periscope goes under the rough sea so often that I have about four seconds of visibility at a time before the waves blind me again. Bottom line: I can't see a thing. But I've got a dozen or more sound contacts all around, and I'm not about to lose them. Rigged for silent running, I start off cautiously westward, just barely slower than the convoy.

***
Time is running out. If I don't decide on something soon I'll lose them in the bad weather.

I actually whisper to myself: "Skrew it." If I can't see anything from periscope I might as well surface and see if that helps, even if the sound contacts are all but on top of me. "Auftauchen" (really enjoying these new GWX audio cues). I hop on on deck to take a look around. I can't believe it: nothing. More blackness. But the sound contacts were right there - right on top of me. My watch crew reports no sightings. Carefully, carefully, I swing around with my binoculars.

Then, something. A grey splotch almost totally hidden in darkness, rain, and waves. Right around bearing 270. I swear it's under 100 meters. We're running almost perfectly parallel. It's heading is steady. I don't think it's seen me. I turn to my watch officer. Do you see that?? The watch crew reports no sightings (!!!). God's sake.

I scratch my head. The grey splotch (it's rather small) is pulling slowly ahead of me. I don't want to increase my speed, because God if I know how it hasn't seen me yet. If I don't do something now, I'll lose it. On the one hand, I'm afraid to launch a torpedo at this range lest I get caught in the blast. On the other, I'm afraid to maneuver away and lose sight of the ship, that beautiful prey that I've been chasing for about two hours of my own time.

I mutter to myself again: 'Skrew it.' I begin to rig a torpedo for firing with a magnetic detonator. I'm running at speed so my gyro angle calculations would probably be useless. I manually adjust the angle to run about 50 degrees port. Fire. I watch on the event camera with my fists clenched (Yeah, I use the event camera - for dramatic effect). There's the hull. Aaaaaand CLANG! Bounces right off.

I hold my breath, waiting on deck for all hell to break loose in the convoy. Nothing. How did the crew not notice that? No time to wonder. I must have got the angle too steep. I rig the next torp (also magnetic) to run out further ahead of me, then right angle port. That should get a solid hit. No chance of a bad angle here. Fire.

I hold my breath again, praying we don't get caught in the blast. I watch the event camera. There's the hull! It's perpendicular. It's gonna hit. There it goes... Aaaaaaand CLANG! Bounces right off - again.

No time for confusion. I watch in horror from my bridge as, at almost the instant of impact, a spotlight flashes to life on the deck of my prey and immediately swings starboard. I disappear below deck as the floodlight drifts over our hull. Alaaarm! Crash dive! We hear a number of rounds ping off the exposed conning tower as we run like Hell down. We got lucky that we got deep enough and far enough to avoid the depth charges, though a number came real close. I held my breath for the next twenty minutes with no kills to notch on my bullet-riddled conning tower.

What went wrong?

The first torp probably hit at too steep an angle, but the second hit dead on.

Well, my greenness sure didn't help. I later found the magnetic detonators unreliable on several occasions. I switched to impact only and had much more luck.

I can think of a few things that might have happened.

1. The ships had demagnetized hulls and my detonators were not yet rigged to compensate. My patrol was in late 1940 so this might be historically accurate.

2. The magnetic detonators will only go off underneath the a target in GWX. This is how they were intended to be used historically, but I don't understand why literally hitting the side of the hull wouldn't set them off.

3. The detonators are unreliable. This would also be historically accurate for 1940, but after so many failures I have to wonder (as did the real life kaleuns and Doenitz himself when the British found a way to demagnetize their hulls).

I'm leaning toward the first conclusion. I've since switched to contact detonators with much more success, but I don't think the BdU will be all that happy with me if I continue using primitive detonators indefinitely.

What do the vets say? Are the hulls demagnetized, or am I just Bernard?

hauangua · 06-04-17, 01:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sophist

(TLDR: Interesting part at ***)

Other kaleuns call me Italian. I'm ashamed.

I've never been ashamed to be Italian...

Hey.... but you are from?..

Pisces · 06-04-17, 08:58 AM

Hold your horses gentlemen. I'm sure Sophist didn't mean anything to offend Italian people. I'm sure it was meant as a way to 'embellish' his story in that timeframe. Think of it as the German Navy officers feeling them selves superior and more daring than their allies. There is no need to take this poetic license serious at all. Disarm your torpedoes and deckgun please.

That said, it might have been wiser to come up with a better way to mock his character. (by himself)

Jimbuna · 06-04-17, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pisces

Hold your horses gentlemen. I'm sure Sophist didn't mean anything to offend Italian people. I'm sure it was meant as a way to 'embellish' his story in that timeframe. Think of it as the German Navy officers feeling them selves superior and more daring than their allies. There is no need to take this poetic license serious at all. Disarm your torpedoes and deckgun please.

That said, it might have been wiser to come up with a better way to mock his character. (by himself)

Wise counsel, I'm all for that

Sailor Steve · 06-04-17, 10:02 AM

I believe Pisces is probably right. In either case we try to encourage people to find out what was meant before going on the attack. It looks to me that until he starts discussing the possible causes he is staying in character within the context of his story. Whatever the case may be, calling someone "stupid" is very much frowned upon here.

As to Sophist's own questions, I'm pretty sure that SH3 doesn't deal with magnetized hulls. The problem is probably the heavy weather. It plays all kinds of havoc with torpedoes, and it's never a good idea to attack when the waves are high.

Jimbuna · 06-04-17, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by itadriver

We can go on to say: i'm all for that... i'm all for this, but.....

Care to explain and or elaborate further?

Pisces · 06-04-17, 11:49 AM

Considering this forum has an international audience. And as we don't know which timezone Sophist is from. We might have to give Sophist some time to respond. He could be sleeping now.

hauangua · 06-04-17, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

I believe Pisces is probably right. In either case we try to encourage people to find out what was meant before going on the attack. It looks to me that until he starts discussing the possible causes he is staying in character within the context of his story. Whatever the case may be, calling someone "stupid" is very much frowned upon here.

As to Sophist's own questions, I'm pretty sure that SH3 doesn't deal with magnetized hulls. The problem is probably the heavy weather. It plays all kinds of havoc with torpedoes, and it's never a good idea to attack when the waves are high.

Hello Sailor Steve
i'm sorry yes .. But I do not change my idea ... I'm tired of all these stereotypes...
and again i'm sorry ...

Sailor Steve · 06-04-17, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by itadriver

@steve I didnt offend anyone. I have just asked an explanation by sophist. Have i asked so much?

Did you use the word "stupidity" in your comments? No? Then my observation wasn't aimed at you.

On the other hand you did also tell him to wash his mouth out before talking about Italians, which is a bit more than just asking for an explanation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hauangua

i'm sorry yes .. But I do not change my idea ... I'm tired of all these stereotypes...and i'm really curious...Where is he from?

And you're free to state your opinions. We do have specific rules about name-calling, though.

Quote:

The Radio Room forum is not the place for flaming, spewing, or otherwise mouthing off. We do not allow posts where people are called idiots, morons, etc. We respect your freedom of speech, we ask that you respect our rules. You are welcome to express your opinion about games and other subjects.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/faq....ules3_faq_item

Quote:

and again i'm sorry ... but i think if it is true that the brain is the most powerful weapon that has been given to man ... probably sophist is a pacifist...
maybe so is better

What he believes or doesn't believe is irrelevant, and you won't know until he actually says it himself.

The bottom line here is that people are jumping to conclusions without giving the OP the time to explain. We (the SubSim staff) don't want to drive people away before they have the chance to say what they mean, and we do enforce the rules against open attacks (name-calling, etc). Please try to keep conversations polite. We want SubSim to be a friendly place.

Sophist · 06-05-17, 10:30 PM

I'm so sorry Italian friends! I really didn't mean it to be a nationalist insult!

It was indeed a narrative embellishment, as Pisces mentioned, a reference to the perceived performance of Italian submariners in the North Atlantic. It didn't even occur to me that it might be taken badly.

No one should be ashamed to be Italian - it is a fine country with fine people.

A thousand apologies.

I edited the original thread to remove the offending bit. A darn shame my carelessness turned this thread from being a fun little KTB to a what it is. I indeed deserve appellation "stupid".

(Admins, feel free to scrub the thread after a few days to give folks the chance to see my redaction. I'll take no offense.)

Edit: Sorry for the delay. I don't check the forum every day.

hauangua · 06-05-17, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sophist

I'm so sorry Italian friends! I really didn't mean it to be a nationalist insult!

It was indeed a narrative embellishment, as Pisces mentioned, a reference to the perceived performance of Italian submariners in the North Atlantic. It didn't even occur to me that it might be taken badly.

No one should be ashamed to be Italian - it is a fine country with fine people.

A thousand apologies.

I edited the original thread to remove the offending bit. A darn shame my carelessness turned this thread from being a fun little KTB to a what it is. I indeed deserve appellation "stupid".

(Admins, feel free to scrub the thread after a few days to give folks the chance to see my redaction. I'll take no offense.)

Edit: Sorry for the delay. I don't check the forum every day.

OK sophist now it's better
and I deleted Inappropriate/offensive phrases from my post...

but where are you from?

itadriver · 06-05-17, 11:51 PM

ok. It was just a misunderstanding. You are welcome.
Ciao sophist.

PapaSmurf · 06-07-17, 10:01 PM

Back to the main topic. My guess as to why the torpedoes did not detonate is that he was too close to the target because of the bad weather and the torpedoes didn't have time to arm themselves. He said the target was no more than 100 meters away. I've found anything less than 300 to 350 meters range is almost a guaranteed dud.

Jimbuna · 06-08-17, 05:38 AM

T1's need 300m travelling distance to arm and the Falke requires 400m.

06-04-17, 12:54 AM	#1
Sophist Swabbie Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 6 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	KTB of a Green Kaleun (Bernard) (TLDR: Interesting part at *) Informal KTB of U-46, Leutnant z. s. Sophist I made this Subsim account some time ago, hoping to put in some good hours into SI3 and post some interesting stories. Life got busy, and I was unable to do so. Here I am, after a bit of lurking on the forums, with a little story of a debacle that I thought might be funny to the old salts. I put in a few dozen hours (~40) into the vanilla career. I figured out, slowly, how to mount an effective attack under decent conditions and eased myself off the training wheels. I figured I was pretty decent at the vanilla game; let's try this GWX thing I've heard so much about. I start off a career in 1940, around the time I left off my vanilla career. Right off I'm impressed by the depth of GWX. I skim the recognition manual as my type VIIB slowly floats out of Lorient. BdU sends me somewhere around CF33. I patrolled for about 24 hours with no sightings. Then word comes in: large convoy sighted near CG11 headed NNW slow. Now, bear in mind. I had, to this point, never engaged a convoy - neither in vanilla nor GWX. I get quite intimidated by the nasty frigate and corvette escorts. I unsuccessfully shadow the convoy and get spotted several times. I lost contact when some air patrols force me under 200 km off Cornwall. [REDACTED; no offense intended]. After some time, report comes in of another convoy, this one outbound west. I decide on a new strategy: get visual contact, estimate the course, then dip around and wait way out front. I do so, sitting quietly under the waves, and soon I'm getting sound contacts all over the place. I wait, real patiently, while the sound contacts get closer and the contact I figure must be the lead frigate passes on by. It looks like I'm at the southern edge of the westbound convoy. It's deep night at this point, so I raise my periscope cautiously to take a look around. The waves are massive and I can see nothing but torrential rain, frothing waters, and darkness. My periscope goes under the rough sea so often that I have about four seconds of visibility at a time before the waves blind me again. Bottom line: I can't see a thing. But I've got a dozen or more sound contacts all around, and I'm not about to lose them. Rigged for silent running, I start off cautiously westward, just barely slower than the convoy. * Time is running out. If I don't decide on something soon I'll lose them in the bad weather. I actually whisper to myself: "Skrew it." If I can't see anything from periscope I might as well surface and see if that helps, even if the sound contacts are all but on top of me. "Auftauchen" (really enjoying these new GWX audio cues). I hop on on deck to take a look around. I can't believe it: nothing. More blackness. But the sound contacts were right there - right on top of me. My watch crew reports no sightings. Carefully, carefully, I swing around with my binoculars. Then, something. A grey splotch almost totally hidden in darkness, rain, and waves. Right around bearing 270. I swear it's under 100 meters. We're running almost perfectly parallel. It's heading is steady. I don't think it's seen me. I turn to my watch officer. Do you see that?? The watch crew reports no sightings (!!!). God's sake. I scratch my head. The grey splotch (it's rather small) is pulling slowly ahead of me. I don't want to increase my speed, because God if I know how it hasn't seen me yet. If I don't do something now, I'll lose it. On the one hand, I'm afraid to launch a torpedo at this range lest I get caught in the blast. On the other, I'm afraid to maneuver away and lose sight of the ship, that beautiful prey that I've been chasing for about two hours of my own time. I mutter to myself again: 'Skrew it.' I begin to rig a torpedo for firing with a magnetic detonator. I'm running at speed so my gyro angle calculations would probably be useless. I manually adjust the angle to run about 50 degrees port. Fire. I watch on the event camera with my fists clenched (Yeah, I use the event camera - for dramatic effect). There's the hull. Aaaaaand CLANG! Bounces right off. I hold my breath, waiting on deck for all hell to break loose in the convoy. Nothing. How did the crew not notice that? No time to wonder. I must have got the angle too steep. I rig the next torp (also magnetic) to run out further ahead of me, then right angle port. That should get a solid hit. No chance of a bad angle here. Fire. I hold my breath again, praying we don't get caught in the blast. I watch the event camera. There's the hull! It's perpendicular. It's gonna hit. There it goes... Aaaaaaand CLANG! Bounces right off - again. No time for confusion. I watch in horror from my bridge as, at almost the instant of impact, a spotlight flashes to life on the deck of my prey and immediately swings starboard. I disappear below deck as the floodlight drifts over our hull. Alaaarm! Crash dive! We hear a number of rounds ping off the exposed conning tower as we run like Hell down. We got lucky that we got deep enough and far enough to avoid the depth charges, though a number came real close. I held my breath for the next twenty minutes with no kills to notch on my bullet-riddled conning tower. What went wrong? The first torp probably hit at too steep an angle, but the second hit dead on. Well, my greenness sure didn't help. I later found the magnetic detonators unreliable on several occasions. I switched to impact only and had much more luck. I can think of a few things that might have happened. 1. The ships had demagnetized hulls and my detonators were not yet rigged to compensate. My patrol was in late 1940 so this might be historically accurate. 2. The magnetic detonators will only go off underneath the a target in GWX. This is how they were intended to be used historically, but I don't understand why literally hitting the side of the hull wouldn't set them off. 3. The detonators are unreliable. This would also be historically accurate for 1940, but after so many failures I have to wonder (as did the real life kaleuns and Doenitz himself when the British found a way to demagnetize their hulls). I'm leaning toward the first conclusion. I've since switched to contact detonators with much more success, but I don't think the BdU will be all that happy with me if I continue using primitive detonators indefinitely. What do the vets say? Are the hulls demagnetized, or am I just Bernard? Last edited by Sophist; 06-05-17 at 10:25 PM.

06-04-17, 08:58 AM	#3
Pisces Silent Hunter Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: AN9771 Posts: 4,892 Downloads: 300 Uploads: 0	Hold your horses gentlemen. I'm sure Sophist didn't mean anything to offend Italian people. I'm sure it was meant as a way to 'embellish' his story in that timeframe. Think of it as the German Navy officers feeling them selves superior and more daring than their allies. There is no need to take this poetic license serious at all. Disarm your torpedoes and deckgun please. That said, it might have been wiser to come up with a better way to mock his character. (by himself) Last edited by Pisces; 06-04-17 at 09:26 AM.

06-04-17, 10:02 AM	#5
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	I believe Pisces is probably right. In either case we try to encourage people to find out what was meant before going on the attack. It looks to me that until he starts discussing the possible causes he is staying in character within the context of his story. Whatever the case may be, calling someone "stupid" is very much frowned upon here. As to Sophist's own questions, I'm pretty sure that SH3 doesn't deal with magnetized hulls. The problem is probably the heavy weather. It plays all kinds of havoc with torpedoes, and it's never a good idea to attack when the waves are high. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

06-05-17, 10:30 PM	#10
Sophist Swabbie Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 6 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	I'm so sorry Italian friends! I really didn't mean it to be a nationalist insult! It was indeed a narrative embellishment, as Pisces mentioned, a reference to the perceived performance of Italian submariners in the North Atlantic. It didn't even occur to me that it might be taken badly. No one should be ashamed to be Italian - it is a fine country with fine people. A thousand apologies. I edited the original thread to remove the offending bit. A darn shame my carelessness turned this thread from being a fun little KTB to a what it is. I indeed deserve appellation "stupid". (Admins, feel free to scrub the thread after a few days to give folks the chance to see my redaction. I'll take no offense.) Edit: Sorry for the delay. I don't check the forum every day. Last edited by Sophist; 06-05-17 at 10:31 PM. Reason: Explaining delay in correction

06-08-17, 05:38 AM	#14
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 181,120 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	T1's need 300m travelling distance to arm and the Falke requires 400m. __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!! GWX3.0 Download Page - Donation/instant access to GWX (Help SubSim)

06-04-17, 11:49 AM	#7
Pisces Silent Hunter Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: AN9771 Posts: 4,892 Downloads: 300 Uploads: 0	Considering this forum has an international audience. And as we don't know which timezone Sophist is from. We might have to give Sophist some time to respond. He could be sleeping now.

06-05-17, 11:51 PM	#12
itadriver Commander Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Italia Venezia Posts: 464 Downloads: 221 Uploads: 0	ok. It was just a misunderstanding. You are welcome. Ciao sophist.

06-07-17, 10:01 PM	#13
PapaSmurf Bosun Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: On the front of a bass boat or in a deer stand Posts: 64 Downloads: 129 Uploads: 0	Back to the main topic. My guess as to why the torpedoes did not detonate is that he was too close to the target because of the bad weather and the torpedoes didn't have time to arm themselves. He said the target was no more than 100 meters away. I've found anything less than 300 to 350 meters range is almost a guaranteed dud.