UC3 Nautilus sunk - Peter Madsen charged with murder of journalist Kim Wall - Page 8

em2nought · 08-23-17, 03:21 AM

I was moving a heavy, heavy sheet of soaking pressure treated plywood today, and I now know why he chopped her up. He chopped her up so he could more easily throw her out of the control tower. I think she died by accident, slipped going down a ladder or something, and he freaked out in a panic.

Catfish · 08-23-17, 03:43 AM

^ Panic? All limbs and the head, and then an iron weight to keep it submerged.. possible of course.
There can be all kinds of psychological things as well: he assaulted her and she tried to defend and all that. Or she threatened to write something bad about him without anything explicit happening, and so he killed her in fury. I do not think it was planned, too implausible lying.
All very ugly.
The only thing that can help him is to tell or confess it all, if behind closed doors.

Schroeder · 08-23-17, 03:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by em2nought

I was moving a heavy, heavy sheet of soaking pressure treated plywood today, and I now know why he chopped her up. He chopped her up so he could more easily throw her out of the control tower.

No need to cut the head off for that.

Besides even if he had panicked, he had plenty of time tell the authorities the truth in the meantime.

Mr Quatro · 08-23-17, 04:16 AM

It must be hard to kill someone and then chop them up and throw them overboard. If he has any heart and soul left he will confess the entire mess and ask the court for mercy.

Sooner or later men like this break down

Jimbuna · 08-23-17, 05:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

It must be hard to kill someone and then chop them up and throw them overboard. If he has any heart and soul left he will confess the entire mess and ask the court for mercy.

Hopefully that will be the case.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

Sooner or later men like this break down

Usually but not always. I once met Peter Sutcliffe.

Jimbuna · 08-23-17, 05:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

It must be hard to kill someone and then chop them up and throw them overboard. If he has any heart and soul left he will confess the entire mess and ask the court for mercy.

Hopefully that will be the case.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

Sooner or later men like this break down

Usually but not always. I once met Peter Sutcliffe.

Quote:

A headless torso found in waters off Denmark has been identified as missing Swedish journalist Kim Wall, Danish police say.
DNA from the torso matched that from Ms Wall's hairbrush and toothbrush.
Chief investigator Jens Moller Jensen said that the torso had been weighted down with metal in an apparent attempt to stop it floating.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41021223

Dr.Sid · 08-23-17, 05:35 AM

All murderers are normal people, until they at one single moment, become murderers. Even psychologist who met hundreds of murderers wont be able to tell who will become one in most cases.

Carotio · 08-23-17, 05:44 AM

http://nyheder.tv2.dk/krimi/2017-08-...g-forfaerdelse
http://nyheder.tv2.dk/krimi/2017-08-...l-nu-er-fundet

The police has secured DNA from the home of KW, and there is a match between that DNA and the torso, plus they have found dried blood in Nautilus, which also match the DNA from KW.
So no doubt about it. She died onboard, and he cut her up in pieces. He has made holes in the torso plus attached metal, so the body would stay down on the seafloor. The attorney of PM has stated that PM has expressed relief that she has been found.
The mother of KW has made a statement on facebook saying that it's with horror and sorrow that the family has received the news of her death. She focuses her message on KW, and how wonderful a person she was, and how wonderful KW worked to make the world a better place. She doesn't mention any hate or anything like that towards PM.

My personal comment about the situation sofar is:
Well, I'm really wondering why PM hasn't told the police that they should be looking for a torso/cut-up body. If he had told that, I'm sure the public would have been told to look for body parts. So his relief, well, it ain't worth anything. I think that he hoped the body wouldn't be found. Why would he otherwise attach heavy metal to the body to keep it down?
Now, it's up to the police to investigate whether or not it was an accident, or if he killed her or not. No matter what, he has dealt with the body in such a bad manner that he faces up to 6 months in jail for that alone.
We have had trials before where manslaughter has been the result because of many pieces of circumstantial evidence. Plus he has lied about her whereabouts. So has he lied too about her death being an accident? It doesn't look good for him.
Also several of his sponsors have decided to step back and leave his space project. Even if he escapes a long prison sentence and only go to jail for 6 months, then he will forever be persona non grata.
Having met him at the subsim meet 2009, I really liked him and his projects back then. But this act is in my world really hard to forgive. You can argue with a person over unimportant stuff, and they go apart. But such an outcome to cut up a body and throw it overboard at sea - that's just too much.

Reece · 08-23-17, 06:20 AM

Whether it was an accident or murder it happened on board, I'd guess the body weight was too much for him to lift up through the hatch so he cut her up into more manageable pieces. Naturally this would have made a bloody mess in the sub so the easiest way to clean up was to scuttle it.

Sorry if my description is too descriptive.

Nasty either way!!!

My heart goes out to her loved ones, may she rest in peace.

Rip · 08-23-17, 06:56 AM

If I were on the jury he would never get out. No excuse for what we already know he has done, nothing can justify that.

He was a monster lurking amongst us, we just have to face that.

Such a beautiful and energetic lady, tragic.

RIP Kim.

horsa · 08-23-17, 07:05 AM

Whatever the final explanation (and there may never be a complete one) this is horrific. My thoughts go out to Kim Wall's friends and family.

Rockstar · 08-23-17, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rip

If I were on the jury he would never get out. No excuse for what we already know he has done, nothing can justify that.

He was a monster lurking amongst us, we just have to face that.

Such a beautiful and energetic lady, tragic.

RIP Kim.

This ^

Red October1984 · 08-23-17, 10:26 AM

Jesus. Whether he did it on purpose or out of fear/panic, this is an unfortunate and avoidable event that no family should have to go through.

I have never met PM, but I've seen many speak highly of him through the years. But as it's been said, you never know what some turn out to be.

As much as we're ready to convict however, (and i'm not sure how Danish law works) there still must be a trial and conviction. If he did, in fact, murder her for whatever reason....there has to be proof of that disproving the "accident" theory.

From my point of view, I see an error on PM's part by not having a third person aboard. Regardless of who the passenger is, there should be a third person familiar with the submarine operations aboard the boat during any trip involving a guest. If there was an accident, there would have been a witness and somebody to hold PM accountable to call the police and do the normal thing. If there had been a murder, again, there would have been a witness (unfortunately possibly another victim). Additionally, a second set of eyes could help catch things possibly commonly overlooked by PM or passenger. It's a safety thing that could have been very avoidable if he had just asked a friend to come along and help with the trip.

Schroeder · 08-23-17, 11:19 AM

Frankly I don't buy the whole accident thing anymore. Even if one panics after a fatal accident one doesn't cut the corpse to pieces, throws it overboard and scuttles one own submarine. He's had plenty of time to come clean but chose to tell the police more BS. That doesn't sound like someone who just accidentally killed someone and panicked.

Catfish · 08-23-17, 12:44 PM

As Gargamel pointed out before, when there is a fatal or whatever accident at sea in a private boat, the first thing is to infoorm and call for help via the mandatory radio installed on every seagoing vessel with an engine, on emergency channel #16, giving assumed position and situation.
You do not bury anyone at sea, this is complete rubbish especially only a few miles from the coast in the baltic sea.
I just wonder what he thought about getting away with that

08-23-17, 03:21 AM	#106
em2nought Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 3,262 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I was moving a heavy, heavy sheet of soaking pressure treated plywood today, and I now know why he chopped her up. He chopped her up so he could more easily throw her out of the control tower. I think she died by accident, slipped going down a ladder or something, and he freaked out in a panic. __________________ Looks like we need a Lemon Law for Presidents now! DNC sold us a dud, and they knew it.

08-23-17, 03:43 AM	#107
Catfish Dipped Squirrel Operative Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: ..where the ocean meets the sky Posts: 16,895 Downloads: 38 Uploads: 0	^ Panic? All limbs and the head, and then an iron weight to keep it submerged.. possible of course. There can be all kinds of psychological things as well: he assaulted her and she tried to defend and all that. Or she threatened to write something bad about him without anything explicit happening, and so he killed her in fury. I do not think it was planned, too implausible lying. All very ugly. The only thing that can help him is to tell or confess it all, if behind closed doors. __________________ >^..^<*)))>{ All generalizations are wrong.

08-23-17, 04:16 AM	#109
Mr Quatro Navy Seal Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 6,772 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	It must be hard to kill someone and then chop them up and throw them overboard. If he has any heart and soul left he will confess the entire mess and ask the court for mercy. Sooner or later men like this break down __________________ pla•teau noun a relatively stable level, period, or condition a level of attainment or achievement Lord help me get to the next plateau ..

08-23-17, 05:35 AM	#112
Dr.Sid The Old Man Join Date: May 2005 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 1,458 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	All murderers are normal people, until they at one single moment, become murderers. Even psychologist who met hundreds of murderers wont be able to tell who will become one in most cases. __________________ ComSubSim forum at CADC

08-23-17, 05:44 AM	#113
Carotio Mr. Bad Wolf Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Aabenraa, Denmark Posts: 1,488 Downloads: 47 Uploads: 0	http://nyheder.tv2.dk/krimi/2017-08-...g-forfaerdelse http://nyheder.tv2.dk/krimi/2017-08-...l-nu-er-fundet The police has secured DNA from the home of KW, and there is a match between that DNA and the torso, plus they have found dried blood in Nautilus, which also match the DNA from KW. So no doubt about it. She died onboard, and he cut her up in pieces. He has made holes in the torso plus attached metal, so the body would stay down on the seafloor. The attorney of PM has stated that PM has expressed relief that she has been found. The mother of KW has made a statement on facebook saying that it's with horror and sorrow that the family has received the news of her death. She focuses her message on KW, and how wonderful a person she was, and how wonderful KW worked to make the world a better place. She doesn't mention any hate or anything like that towards PM. My personal comment about the situation sofar is: Well, I'm really wondering why PM hasn't told the police that they should be looking for a torso/cut-up body. If he had told that, I'm sure the public would have been told to look for body parts. So his relief, well, it ain't worth anything. I think that he hoped the body wouldn't be found. Why would he otherwise attach heavy metal to the body to keep it down? Now, it's up to the police to investigate whether or not it was an accident, or if he killed her or not. No matter what, he has dealt with the body in such a bad manner that he faces up to 6 months in jail for that alone. We have had trials before where manslaughter has been the result because of many pieces of circumstantial evidence. Plus he has lied about her whereabouts. So has he lied too about her death being an accident? It doesn't look good for him. Also several of his sponsors have decided to step back and leave his space project. Even if he escapes a long prison sentence and only go to jail for 6 months, then he will forever be persona non grata. Having met him at the subsim meet 2009, I really liked him and his projects back then. But this act is in my world really hard to forgive. You can argue with a person over unimportant stuff, and they go apart. But such an outcome to cut up a body and throw it overboard at sea - that's just too much. __________________ Download my mods from SHMF Follow my photography here taler dansk, speak English, spreche Deutsch, parle français, forstår svenska/norsk, comprendo castellano

08-23-17, 06:20 AM	#114
Reece CINC Pacific Fleet Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Down Under Posts: 32,732 Downloads: 171 Uploads: 0	Whether it was an accident or murder it happened on board, I'd guess the body weight was too much for him to lift up through the hatch so he cut her up into more manageable pieces. Naturally this would have made a bloody mess in the sub so the easiest way to clean up was to scuttle it. Sorry if my description is too descriptive. Nasty either way!!! My heart goes out to her loved ones, may she rest in peace. __________________ *Sub captains go down with their ship!*

08-23-17, 06:56 AM	#115
Rip Commodore Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Right behind you! Posts: 643 Downloads: 39 Uploads: 0	If I were on the jury he would never get out. No excuse for what we already know he has done, nothing can justify that. He was a monster lurking amongst us, we just have to face that. Such a beautiful and energetic lady, tragic. RIP Kim.

08-23-17, 07:05 AM	#116
horsa Pacific Aces Dev Team Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Halifax, England Posts: 502 Downloads: 44 Uploads: 3	Whatever the final explanation (and there may never be a complete one) this is horrific. My thoughts go out to Kim Wall's friends and family. __________________ "You need to put your behind in the past". Kumba

08-23-17, 10:26 AM	#118
Red October1984 Airplane Nerd Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Texas Posts: 6,241 Downloads: 115 Uploads: 0	Jesus. Whether he did it on purpose or out of fear/panic, this is an unfortunate and avoidable event that no family should have to go through. I have never met PM, but I've seen many speak highly of him through the years. But as it's been said, you never know what some turn out to be. As much as we're ready to convict however, (and i'm not sure how Danish law works) there still must be a trial and conviction. If he did, in fact, murder her for whatever reason....there has to be proof of that disproving the "accident" theory. From my point of view, I see an error on PM's part by not having a third person aboard. Regardless of who the passenger is, there should be a third person familiar with the submarine operations aboard the boat during any trip involving a guest. If there was an accident, there would have been a witness and somebody to hold PM accountable to call the police and do the normal thing. If there had been a murder, again, there would have been a witness (unfortunately possibly another victim). Additionally, a second set of eyes could help catch things possibly commonly overlooked by PM or passenger. It's a safety thing that could have been very avoidable if he had just asked a friend to come along and help with the trip. __________________

08-23-17, 11:19 AM	#119
Schroeder Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Banana Republic of Germany Posts: 6,170 Downloads: 62 Uploads: 0	Frankly I don't buy the whole accident thing anymore. Even if one panics after a fatal accident one doesn't cut the corpse to pieces, throws it overboard and scuttles one own submarine. He's had plenty of time to come clean but chose to tell the police more BS. That doesn't sound like someone who just accidentally killed someone and panicked. __________________ Putting Germ back into Germany.

08-23-17, 12:44 PM	#120
Catfish Dipped Squirrel Operative Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: ..where the ocean meets the sky Posts: 16,895 Downloads: 38 Uploads: 0	As Gargamel pointed out before, when there is a fatal or whatever accident at sea in a private boat, the first thing is to infoorm and call for help via the mandatory radio installed on every seagoing vessel with an engine, on emergency channel #16, giving assumed position and situation. You do not bury anyone at sea, this is complete rubbish especially only a few miles from the coast in the baltic sea. I just wonder what he thought about getting away with that __________________ >^..^<*)))>{ All generalizations are wrong.