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Old 12-15-15, 10:04 AM   #556
Jimbuna
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Originally Posted by Nippelspanner View Post
Just because you're the admin of this page doesn't mean you can't have or express your opinion, I really don't see the connection some seem to make.
When you start to make up rules that go against those who disagree, then we'd have a problem here - but I can't imagine that at all.
So long, Subsim always allowed people to share their opinion and thoughts, even questionable ones, as long as they go along with the very sane set of rules we have here.
Edit: (...and the excellent moderation of this board!)
Precisely....adhere to the forum rules and everything should be hunky dory.
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Old 12-15-15, 11:10 AM   #557
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Originally Posted by Neal Stevens View Post
Thanks for that. Someone always calls me out. I don't post that much, but let me say something that's not appropriately PC, like maybe a sovereign nation should have the right to determine its immigration needs and I get a noose around my neck.

It's all just opinions, people, we all have them.
Hey Neal, maybe you should create an anonymous account for posting on GT so you can be a jerk like the rest of us when you want to be without people rage quitting over it...
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Old 12-15-15, 11:31 AM   #558
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Originally Posted by August View Post
Hey Neal, maybe you should create an anonymous account for posting on GT so you can be a jerk like the rest of us when you want to be without people rage quitting over it...
What happens if Jim throws Neal in the slammer?

Better let jim know Neals secret ID.
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Old 12-15-15, 12:49 PM   #559
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Originally Posted by STEED View Post
What happens if Jim throws Neal in the slammer?

Better let jim know Neals secret ID.
I'm surprised that they don't all have secret ID's.
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Old 12-15-15, 01:01 PM   #560
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Just an FYI, my previous post wasnt a slam against 'all' of islam or muslims.

In our small community here we have a few who may be feeling somewhat helpless as they are claiming to witness first hand their neighborhoods take a header and are dealing directly with rising crime rates, assaults, and a waning sense of security. Granted some in the Islamic religion combined with media services and political divisivness make it even harder to deal with.

But for these few speaking out the root problem they say they are seeing, like it or not, are in fact muslim immigrants. And it seems to me when those few come out and accurately identify the source of their problem. Others who have nothing at all in common with their current situation just outright accuse them of not understanding, being or thinking like a nazi, or chastise them its not all muslims, get diagnosed by internet quacks with a phobia, and scolded for not being more tolerent.

Anyone should be able to say someone is messing up my neighborhood without the PC police getting their panties in a wad and accuse the person of having a phobia. Im fairly certain they, the actual victim, is not phobic, they are not nazis, they do understand, and know not everyone from the middle east is messing things up

They are however probably more than a little ticked off.
Bingo.

Yes, there is a problem, but it's not Islam itself it's a whole mixture of screw-ups from top to bottom which leads to a rise in extremist attitudes both in the Muslim and non-Muslim population of an area. Which then leads to a feed back loop of distrust and eventual fear and hatred between the two communities. Ultimately things come to a head, and there is violence, but eventually things do tend to work themselves out if past events are any indication.
In the UK we had problems with the, and I'm going to break with the PC for a moment here because I can't think of a better term, Black communities back in the late 1970s and early 1980s, there was a mounting influx of people from both the East Indies and Africa, and this lead to white Britains feeling that they were being pushed out of their neighbourhoods by these foreign people, the Police clashed with Black youths fairly regularly, stopping them and searching them because they looked 'suspicious' to the police and eventually it lead to riots. Jim probably remembers a few of them, Toxteth for example.

I think when it boils down to it, a lot of the problems in the west with Islamic extremism can be traced at least partially to the fear of the unknown and the different. The media definitely plays on that with an almost 'stranger-danger' approach, highlighting the transgressions made by these new people and ignoring anything positive. This then colours peoples impressions before they've even met their first Muslim refugee, and thus when they do it's usually with a closed rather than an open mind.
Faced with this rise of negativity towards their existence, the refugees will be drawn towards their own kind, folding inwards on themselves rather than outward into the wider community, and this will be seized on by recruiters for Daesh who will highlight the transgressions made by the west against the refugees and ignore anything positive, and thus the battle-lines are drawn.

It takes two to tango as they say, and there are extremists on both sides of this story, and sure there are extremists who want to pander to every single whim of these people rather than reach something in the middle ground. People probably view me as one of those, if not worse.

Who knows, maybe we'll be able to link up with them to tackle the extremists in both our communities, that would be nice.

But, I suspect that as with most things in humanity, it's going to get worse before it gets better. If growing trends in both communities are anything to go by, it's not going to be a pretty couple of decades ahead.
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Old 12-15-15, 01:18 PM   #561
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Originally Posted by August View Post
I'm surprised that they don't all have secret ID's.
Makes you wonder.
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Old 12-15-15, 01:36 PM   #562
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
Huh? No, no, no I meant in general, sorry if that was worded badly. The collision between Freedom of Speech and Internal Security is a problem in all the western world at the moment.
In regards to expressing your own opinion, that would probably depend on if you were talking as Neal Stevens the owner of Subsim and its representative, or Neal Stevens the user of Subsim.
It's an awkward situation for any site owner or moderator as August has pointed out in the past. Like it or not, GT is the most active part of this site, and as such is probably where most people will look when they first come to Subsim (although I do note a lot of people stay in the Silent Hunter subforum and don't come down to GT that often), and as the site owner and main face of Subsim, what you say helps shape what Subsim is.
I suppose in one respect it's how what the president of the US does will affect how everyone in the world views Americans as a whole.

But yeah, wasn't targeting you directly, besides I know where you stand on most of these things already.
Whew, ok, thanks for clearing that up. I was glad to read that. Long ago, when I started my first forum, before we had issues with widespread global terrorism, I wanted to be sure this forum was open to all points of view, except for extremists. I know, how do we define "extremist". No matter how carefully we agree to a definition, there are gray areas. So far, I think we all do a pretty good job of keeping things cool.

Yeah, I know what you mean about "admin" showing up in a discussion. Some people pay no attention to it, some get cautious, some seem to go after him to show their independence. I've seen this in other forums where I am not the admin. I try not to post often in political threads, usually once every couple days or so. And I hope this is true, after I make my point, I let it go for a while.


Quote:
Originally Posted by August View Post
Hey Neal, maybe you should create an anonymous account for posting on GT so you can be a jerk like the rest of us when you want to be without people rage quitting over it...
Haha, man, that would interesting. But no, I wouldn't do that to you guys.

Quote:
Originally Posted by STEED View Post
What happens if Jim throws Neal in the slammer?

Better let jim know Neals secret ID.
Why do you think I got polite real fast?
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Old 12-15-15, 01:55 PM   #563
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neal Stevens View Post
Why do you think I got polite real fast?
Jim hid all your beer.

I would do the same if Jim hid all my Pot Noodle Bombay Bay Boy.
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Old 12-15-15, 02:04 PM   #564
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Originally Posted by STEED View Post
Jim hid all your beer.

I would do the same if Jim hid all my Pot Noodle Bombay Bay Boy.
I'm never usually far away

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Old 12-15-15, 02:06 PM   #565
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimbuna View Post
I'm never usually far away

Hi Jim can't stop have check my Pot Noodles.....
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Old 12-15-15, 02:07 PM   #566
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Haha, man, that would interesting. But no, I wouldn't do that to you guys.
NO NO in in Henry V the king walks anonymously among the the troops the night before Agincourt... to get the feel of the troops before the fight!
Quote:
the King arrives incognito upon a trio of soldiers. They are ruminating on their chances of mere survival, let alone victory in the coming fight. The King pretends to be a junior officer and joins in the discussion.
Trio: Me Rockstar and Oberon: Ever a 'band of brothers who hold our manhood cheap' award U the sacred
in advance; "upon St Crisp..." er the anniversary of the Bill of Rights ratified (including the First Amendment) on this date 1792 Gadzooks! someone check the 'thirdman-syndrôme altimeter!
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Old 12-15-15, 02:13 PM   #567
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I have come to the conclusion that I partially agree with people I tend to dissagree and partially disagree with people I tend to agree.
Therefore I am just too much in the center not to get on the nerves of both sides and should really stay out of it.
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Old 12-15-15, 02:18 PM   #568
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Old 12-15-15, 02:18 PM   #569
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Islam originating and practiced in Lizzard Piss Iowa or Po'Dunk China may not be the problem. But I disagree Islam is not at the top of the list of problems in Europe or in some of our community members neighborhoods. Heck, one just has to look at the origin this flood of immigrants are coming from. The entire region has been war against the infidel and each other since the days of Muhammad and it is that culture which operates in the name of Islam being imported into Europe.
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Old 12-15-15, 02:27 PM   #570
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Originally Posted by Betonov View Post
I have come to the conclusion that I partially agree with people I tend to dissagree and partially disagree with people I tend to agree.
Therefore I am just too much in the center not to get on the nerves of both sides and should really stay out of it.
You're a Roman politician at heart!
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