PMDG's 737 extension package - to buy or not buy?

[Kapitan]

You want to try the level D 767 now that's a plane and coming out or just been released the PMDG 777 !

ATM im flying the old feel there 737 classics

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

You want to try the level D 767 now that's a plane and coming out or just been released the PMDG 777 !

ATM im flying the old feel there 737 classics

I know the Level-D 767, and the early versions of it for FS2004 and 2002, when it was still called 767 Pilot in Command.

In itself a robust package, but by today'S standards very outdated in graphics and system depth. It was one of the early carry-overs from 2004 planes to FSX. Many shops do not even list it as an available jewel case anymore.

The 777 is PMDG's new project, but I fear that is still some good time away.

Fear, did I say "fear"? Why do I do that. No clue. the 737 is the most complete package one can imagine.

If you want a challenge, also try PMDG's Jetstream 4100. That one teaches you prfoper engine management for sure. Also very good. My second best module, second only to the 737. But I do not know how often I have sent those engines smoking. The AP also is a totally different design, different to anything I have seen in Boeings, ATRs and Airbusses.

[Kapitan]

Well I belong to a va ba virtual apparently the pmdg 777 is a few months away looking good though but as for level d 767 as far as I was aware its a stand alone add on with no connection to the pic version

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

Well I belong to a va ba virtual apparently the pmdg 777 is a few months away looking good though but as for level d 767 as far as I was aware its a stand alone add on with no connection to the pic version

I know all three versions of, and they are pretty much one and the same package, believe me. Even the visual realization in FSX strongly bases on the earlier incarnations. The first publisher was Wilco who published it under the title "Pilot in Command", later Flight1 took over in that role while the original developer of the first version for FS2002 then officiallycalled himself Level-D.

That it is one and the same simulation line you can see when comparing screenshots of the various versions. The close similarity leaves little argument.

And this is from Level-D homepage:

(...) Tracing its roots back through the 767 Pilot in Command series of releases for FS2000 and FS2002, their release for Microsoft Flight Simulator X (FSX) and Microsoft Flight Simulator 2004 (A Century of Flight) contains ...

It was indeed one of the best - and very early, for FS2000: THE BEST - of its kind. The system failure options of the first package set standards at its time, and they made my neck hair raising when I used them. But today, the evel-D 767 simply is graphically outclassed, and the functionality of it is ordinary and wide-spread industry standard for airliner modules now, no more anythign special. That is no criticism, it just accepts that it is many years old.

It nevertheless still works reliable and flawless. But the virtual cockpit with its many 2D-switches, the system depth, sound environment and generally the technical realisation of the plane, its appearance and avionics, are left behind by modern modules like the PMDG range of products. I saw the PMDG 747, the Flight1 ATR-72-500 and the Level-D 767 to be en par on the FS2004 platform. But on FSX, new kings have taken over the reign.

[Kapitan]

Thanks for the info I didn't actually know that then again I run fs9 but I do like the pmdg range and I do have pmdg 737ng which is the -600 and -700 models I also have the pmdg 747 which is very good and I'm hoping the 777 release will be again very good unfortunTly I don't get time to do research due to work

I would like to pick your brain about the up coming release of the 777 do you think it will be a good investment ? Would you buy the product? What sort of expectations would you hAve with this product as personally previous releases of pmdg have been very good.

I am asking your opinion because I'm pretty sure you have a good handle on flight sims and il be trusting your judgement

On another note I did some time ago well many years now buy pss A330/340 pro would you buy any of their products ? I'm mainly asking a comparison pmdg to pss as I would possibly buy pss 777 pro but I don't want to waste my money and if pmdg in your opinion is better il wait

Thanks skybird

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

Thanks for the info I didn't actually know that then again I run fs9 but I do like the pmdg range and I do have pmdg 737ng which is the -600 and -700 models

I know that one also, but I did not like it. Be aware that the 737NG for FS9 and the 737NGX for FSX have absolutely nothing to do with each other, even if they are both by PMDG. The 737NG was, I think, PMDG's first attempt with FS addons, and it shows it. They have come a very long way since then.

I also have the pmdg 747 which is very good

Yes, definitely one of the two or three best airliners available for FS9. As I saids in the earlier post: the ATR-72/500, the Level-D 767 and the PMDG 747 were my preferred choices on FS9.

and I'm hoping the 777 release will be again very good unfortunately I don't get time to do research due to work

You sure it will be released for FS9? The 737NGX is not for FS9. I know nothing about the 777 release, just heared that it is coming, but I am not assuming they make it a multi-platform release when their last release was FSX exclusively. The Jetstream 4100 already was also exclusively FSX as well.

I would like to pick your brain about the up coming release of the 777 do you think it will be a good investment ? Would you buy the product? What sort of expectations would you hAve with this product as personally previous releases of pmdg have been very good.

I wait and see, as I said I know nothing baout it except that it is coming. A good investement for you it will only be if it is FS9 compatible. The better investment for you would be to switch to FSX. The years when FS9 was better for IFR and FSX was better for VFR, are over, it seems. FSX or Prepar3D (consider that before FSX, maybe!) is and good and solid IFR platform now.

PMDG-737NGX is compatible with Prepare3D. Prepa3D is Lockheed Martin's takeover from Microsoft and fuirther developement of FSX. It is described by some users as looking like FSX but performing smoother and faster than FS9. I have set my eyes on it once I do a manual clean system reinstall, not just a back-copy of an image of my HD.

I am asking your opinion because I'm pretty sure you have a good handle on flight sims and il be trusting your judgement

I am also an individual with personal tastes and subjective opinions!

On another note I did some time ago well many years now buy pss A330/340 pro would you buy any of their products ? I'm mainly asking a comparison pmdg to pss as I would possibly buy pss 777 pro but I don't want to waste my money and if pmdg in your opinion is better il wait

I had the PSS A320 many years back. I was left not overly impressed, and iot does many things simply wrong for an Airbus (simulating typical flight logiocs of Aibusses is difficult in FS because of inherent tehcncial limits of FS). In the high fidelity segment for FSX, PMDG seems to be the ruler on top of the heap.

If I were you, I would really consider a different order of priorities now. FSX already is old, FS2004 is even older.

Change to Prepare3D.
Get a taste of the PMDG 737NGX on it.

Then see how that changes your world. Again, the 737NG that you know on FS9 has nothing, really nothing to do with the NGX version for FSX. It is quantum leap ahead in quality and simulation. the NG also has technical issues with the autoflight system and events, and some others minor thinks, I vaguely recall. I never was happy with it, and avoided it soon after getting it.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=201284

http://www.prepar3d.com/

Thanks skybird

Nixos problemos!

[CCIP]

Good advice Sky, I agree! I think if you were building a civil flight sim setup from scratch today, I would most heartily advise starting with Prepar3D, which is the most solid platform and gives a good compromise between being up-to-date, stability and compatibility with add-ons. Most of what works in FSX works in P3D, and P3D is simply a better platform. FSX by itself is a bit full of holes and inefficiencies (though definitely rules the aftermarket), and FS9, while it's impressive how well it still holds up, is simply out of date and rapidly losing support. I don't think you will see releases for it for much longer. I am on FS9, and there is already quite a few reasons I wish I could get into FSX add-ons instead. When I build my new system later this year, I plan to switch to Prepar3D.

[Skybird]

Kapitan,

if you want to embark on a new airliner in FS9 becasue for some reason you want to stay with FS9, consider the iFly 737. I had it, and I liked it very much. A very solid and "round" package. Okay, it does not compare to PMDG's NGX, but then: nothing compares to the NGX currently. The Chinese (iFly) have delivered a very nice module with their 737, without any real duds included. It became popular on FSX as well. I got it in the late days of my FS9 career, and when I got it I flew almost nothing else anymore.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by CCIP

Good advice Sky, I agree! I think if you were building a civil flight sim setup from scratch today, I would most heartily advise starting with Prepar3D, which is the most solid platform and gives a good compromise between being up-to-date, stability and compatibility with add-ons. Most of what works in FSX works in P3D, and P3D is simply a better platform. FSX by itself is a bit full of holes and inefficiencies (though definitely rules the aftermarket), and FS9, while it's impressive how well it still holds up, is simply out of date and rapidly losing support. I don't think you will see releases for it for much longer. I am on FS9, and there is already quite a few reasons I wish I could get into FSX add-ons instead. When I build my new system later this year, I plan to switch to Prepar3D.

Yep, my next manual system installation will base on Prepar3D, too. They also support TrackIR now, which was a must for me. Currently, my FSX installation works absolutely stable and charming, so there is no need for me to rush. If P3D gets some more version updates until I change to it, it can only become better.

[Kapitan]

I do plan on getting FSX or something better im running a touch screen PC with windows 8 right now and mainly the reason behind running FS9 is simply because all the scenary ive paid for is still on there like mega airports Gatwick heathrow Frankfurt and schipol plus im only really getting back into it after about 2 years absence im trying to slowly claw back a life from work you see.

ATM im happy with FS9 however of course if the PMDG 777 is FSX only then I will buy FSX and get everything again but so far fs9 has no issues still can get online and fly still do basically everything fsx can do just less graphics I guess.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

fs9 has no issues still can get online and fly still do basically everything fsx can do just less graphics I guess.

It's not that simple. The level of system depth in the FSX-PMDG-737NGX is beyond everything you know from FS9. The FS9-PMDG747 is a toy, compared to the NGX. The Level-D 767 is boring, in comparison. There is a reason why the NGX comes with the original Boeing manuals and lists and tables on 3 and a half thousand pages - because you can operate the simulated plane by the original manuals and tables.

Again the advice, once you go after FSX, skip it and take P3D, it is 50 bucks. Same looks - much better performance. They have optimised the FSX-code tremendously, it seems. Better stability and fewer issues. Most what works in FSX, works in P3D as well.

[Skybird]

Indeed, PMDG seems to run the full race again, like they did for the 737NGX, they now do for the 777:

http://www.precisionmanuals.com/prod...?idCategory=23

Compare:

http://www.precisionmanuals.com/prod...?idCategory=20

Ifd they do it like they did in the 737 package, all that stuff will also be included as free PDFs in the installer.

[Skybird]

Sorry, Kapitan, as I assumed, PMDG has confirmed the 777 to be FSX exclusively.

http://forum.avsim.net/topic/372169-...7-information/

FSX will also get a new version of their 747.

Both planes seem to use plenty of the code for the 737NGX, and had it adapted only to the different characteristics and graphics of the planes. The 737NGX was a completely new software development from scratch, and the 777 now seems to benefit from that work - that might be the reason why it is coming so much faster.

[Kapitan]

Thanks skybird you have been a great help, ive been looking for the last few hours about prepa3d and I agree it looks amazing my only thing that concerns me is will the 777 be able to be loaded onto Prepar3d and online flying with VATSIM from what ive read it is possible to connect to vatsim using prepa3d but you need to make a few manual changes to some files.

I personally will go for Prepar3d once my financies settle down (my wallet is still in shock from America) one thing I did find though is you download it from lockheed martin website ? $49.99 if memory serves (only viewed it 2 hours ago).

I just hope it runs on my PC :\

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

Thanks skybird you have been a great help, ive been looking for the last few hours about prepa3d and I agree it looks amazing my only thing that concerns me is will the 777 be able to be loaded onto Prepar3d and online flying with VATSIM from what ive read it is possible to connect to vatsim using prepa3d but you need to make a few manual changes to some files.

I personally will go for Prepar3d once my financies settle down (my wallet is still in shock from America) one thing I did find though is you download it from lockheed martin website ? $49.99 if memory serves (only viewed it 2 hours ago).

I just hope it runs on my PC :\

You're welcome. Yes, 50 bucks for the academic version, it has a very very small, almost invisible watermark saying "prepa3d" in the top right corner. In earlier threads on p3d, I posted a screenshot, trust me, it is no issue to worry about, not at all. Yes, LM is the website from which to ownload it. If you think your rig can handle FSX, it should handle P3D even easier, I think. Some people reported a gain of 10-20 frames when comparing both sims on one and the same system. For most, however, it seems to be relatively the same frames. But: greater stability, fewer issues, no in-sim hardcoded RAM limit of 4GB - FSX cannot use more than 4 GB, where P3D specs say 4+ GB recommended. Further recommended specs is - in LM's words from 2009: quadcore with 2 GHz per core.