[Catfish]

Originally Posted by JU_88

You can lay that guilt trip all you want. Africa and Middle Easts problems don't all stem from Western exploitation and meddling. That's total rubbish. [...]

Yes, i wrote in a provoking tone to make some people think.
And yes, not all problems are, or were, caused by "The West".
But partially, 'we' still are responsible.

- The colonial efforts of most "Empires did not go down well with the invaded countries, i think we can accept that?

- That they came out of this situation as colonies is not necessarily the goodwill of their former rulling empire, but of a lot of struggle – even in India. That some behaved in awful ways and killing lots of their own people along the line, yes. Some learned from us how to do this efficiently.

- When the continent of Africa was divided between those empires, namely England, France, Belgium, Germany, there were artificial borders "erected", straight lines parting ethnicities and constructing "nations" now consisting of different tribes, religions, and opinions. In former times an ethnicity just moved and changed the region it lived in, for better food, evading war, or religious quarrels.

The ruling elite of such new artificial "nation" may consist of a tribe that hates another lower-ranked tribe, and wages war against it. So they flee (=immigrant problem of neighbouring "nation" and so forth), or they are being killed. Civil war, as we just saw in Rwanda, but it is going on in a lot of those "nations".

No doubt, Africa has problems, and aggression and warlords have existed before the colonial clash.
However how belgian king Leopold managed his personal colonies by killing appx. 40,000,000 africans in the process, or how Mr. Rhodes ran his "Rhodesia" (lmao) has forever shaped Africa. Not that most people here even know about it. There are still a lot of files of colonial times stored away from the public e.g. in England, to "not upset the population"

Secondly, Migrants are fine but they need to enter a nation though the proper channels not just climb the fence.

No doubt. Some will indeed flee before attackers and jump into boats for their dear life, but the major portion plans it, and moves illegally, by our standards.

That is illegal in just about every nation on earth. Why does the EU have to be the exception? regardless of history. Nobody has a Right/Entitlement go and live in what ever nation they damn well please with complete disregard for the nations borders and laws.

What makes a living person illegal? You are born in Rwanda or Sudan, and have no papers (due to those artificial borders and the ruling elite tribe not giving you an identity card, because you are of another tribe and they do not like you). Then some Saudis decide to arrest, or kill you, or make you a slave, so you choose to run away. But.. no papers. (see artificial borders, rivaling tribes and elites etc.). Read some books written by Eric Ambler, this 'having papers or not' is a red line connecting all his books, explaining how this world works pretty well.

Again, i agree. The EU being an exception is most probably because of felt guilt and the troubled past (at least Germany of course), but also last not least for the EU's values and publicly declared humanity. And despite all the immigration talk, overall this would be something to be proud of.
It does not work with those masses though, so we have to adapt, yes.

Thirdly, mass migration from the Middle East and Africa is having an inevitable social impact on host nations. You think our children should pay the price for our Parents and Grandparents mistakes?

It seems a lot of especially African children are suffering because of our parents' mistakes. But yes, migration has an impact on host nations.