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Werewolf · 09-14-08, 05:42 AM

@Frame57

Actually I don't think that we're the only ones who would want a sim like that I just think that we're the only ones hounest enough to admit it. It's my impression that for some reason or another many people look upon SH3 and 4 as being not realistic or a historic simulation only, I even heard the word "life simulation" as if it only simulates a random das boot movie. I think this is way off. While SH3 and 4 are maybe simaulating something obsolete, in my eyes, they are a hell of a lot more realistic in many ways than any DW or other modern subsim out there in the sense that they really simulate the fog of war, technical realism, the challenge of improvising in unexpected situations, the challenge of going through a patrol from the first minute it starts to the very minute it ends AT THE BASE etc. etc. I could go on. Just because you build a sim over some up to date equipment and force the player to do manual sonar targeting doesn't mean that you have a second to none super realistic sim on the contrary I find most of the modern sims to be just another Tom Clancy computer script where you get to press a knob or two. And another thing that really annoyes me about "modern sims" is the fact that they tend to presume that the SSK is already distinct, it's always about nukes as if all the other navies out there who are operating SSK's don't exist. And regarding monotunous, life at sea is monotonous some times, but the only sim so far that is able to simulate the change from monotonous routine into adrenaline pumping action is the SH series.....apart from SHII of course, that one really s.....

@One Shot

Yes, I know, and I will be the first to admit that I'm not good at triggers and mission making and so on, but I have really tried and put a lot of effort into it, actually I have spent more time trying to make missions and campaigns than playing. The potential that DW has compared to the SH series, apart from modern equipment etc., is in my eyes the many variotions of missions available, it's not only about sink everything that floats. But it takes millions of scripts and triggers especially if you want to try to make it dynamic and include more than just the classic boomer that is on the run from the good guys. I spent weeks one just one mission and that was even primitive compared to what a pro could have done and like Frame says, once you have made a mission or campaign yourself, it's got no value really, you know where every trigger and ship is hidden, or at least part of it.

The next thing I thought of was a campaign where you start out in a full scale war invorenment in mission 1 from your base. Then the other missions would just be "normal ones" with certain goals, but they are started in different sequence depending on what happens in mission 1. But this is not possible in DW, maybe not in any sim., the campaign missions have to follow the sequence in which they are put from the beginning.

Different SSP's and bottom configurations are a must in my opnion.

And I would like to see a sim more from the engineer aspect as well. especially a nuke must be a challenge for an engineer. There's more to submarining or any navigating than just placing waypoints on a map and spitting out torpedoes, there is a technical aspect as well especially when damaged.

09-14-08, 05:42 AM	#12
Werewolf Sonar Guy Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Europe Posts: 394 Downloads: 69 Uploads: 0	@Frame57 Actually I don't think that we're the only ones who would want a sim like that I just think that we're the only ones hounest enough to admit it. It's my impression that for some reason or another many people look upon SH3 and 4 as being not realistic or a historic simulation only, I even heard the word "life simulation" as if it only simulates a random das boot movie. I think this is way off. While SH3 and 4 are maybe simaulating something obsolete, in my eyes, they are a hell of a lot more realistic in many ways than any DW or other modern subsim out there in the sense that they really simulate the fog of war, technical realism, the challenge of improvising in unexpected situations, the challenge of going through a patrol from the first minute it starts to the very minute it ends AT THE BASE etc. etc. I could go on. Just because you build a sim over some up to date equipment and force the player to do manual sonar targeting doesn't mean that you have a second to none super realistic sim on the contrary I find most of the modern sims to be just another Tom Clancy computer script where you get to press a knob or two. And another thing that really annoyes me about "modern sims" is the fact that they tend to presume that the SSK is already distinct, it's always about nukes as if all the other navies out there who are operating SSK's don't exist. And regarding monotunous, life at sea is monotonous some times, but the only sim so far that is able to simulate the change from monotonous routine into adrenaline pumping action is the SH series.....apart from SHII of course, that one really s..... @One Shot Yes, I know, and I will be the first to admit that I'm not good at triggers and mission making and so on, but I have really tried and put a lot of effort into it, actually I have spent more time trying to make missions and campaigns than playing. The potential that DW has compared to the SH series, apart from modern equipment etc., is in my eyes the many variotions of missions available, it's not only about sink everything that floats. But it takes millions of scripts and triggers especially if you want to try to make it dynamic and include more than just the classic boomer that is on the run from the good guys. I spent weeks one just one mission and that was even primitive compared to what a pro could have done and like Frame says, once you have made a mission or campaign yourself, it's got no value really, you know where every trigger and ship is hidden, or at least part of it. The next thing I thought of was a campaign where you start out in a full scale war invorenment in mission 1 from your base. Then the other missions would just be "normal ones" with certain goals, but they are started in different sequence depending on what happens in mission 1. But this is not possible in DW, maybe not in any sim., the campaign missions have to follow the sequence in which they are put from the beginning. Different SSP's and bottom configurations are a must in my opnion. And I would like to see a sim more from the engineer aspect as well. especially a nuke must be a challenge for an engineer. There's more to submarining or any navigating than just placing waypoints on a map and spitting out torpedoes, there is a technical aspect as well especially when damaged.