Didnt know there was a forum here! I Woulda been coming here for a while!! KSP is way to much fun, Im having problems getting my rockets up into orbit in 18 thought, particularily heavy loads. I am trying to get up a orbital rendevous fuel docking station which carries 4 orange fuel tanks up for transfer. Any ideas guys? IM using stock btw,

Your using Asparagus staging.

Asparagus staging helps you launch large loads efficiently. You either use 4 or 6 boosters(or 8 if you're using smaller tanks). As your tanks empty you drop them. You run fuel lines from your booster tanks into your internal tank. If you're using 4 boosters your boosters run out and then are decoupled leaving your center tank with full fuel.

If you're using 6 tanks you have two options. You can have 3 tanks empty first and then be dropped leaving you with 3 full tanks and your internal tank. Or you can have pairs of 2 empty, and go through 3 pairs and then have your internal tank.

Fuel drains from the first tank in a chain first, even if all the other links in the chain have burning engines. As fuel lines don't care about thrust or gravity, they work in all conditions.

As your tanks empty and are dropped your lowering your weight and thrust as the atmosphere thins. Generally you need more thrust in thicker atmospheres and higher fuel in lower or no atmosphere.

In real life this wouldn't work as we don't have magic fuel lines, and if we did Astronauts are wary of transferring highly explosive fuel between a fragile fuel line while in flight.


If you want an example of asparagus staging look at one of the stock crafts in the game.

Also:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=en4n8fsKWXA
http://i.imgur.com/kh7BN.png

Crossfeeding looks like what I'm using for my MunRocket, it's such a heavy load so it needs all the thrust just to get out of the thickest part of the atmosphere.

I could try just for fun to set it up for asparagus staging and see how it goes. :)

Surely the weight change of the fuel tanks would unbalance the craft during launch and/or cause excessive RCS usage?

The Kerblas design is pretty simple, one big booster at the bottom with three large tanks, six solid fuel boosters which are vettisoned when they empty. It's staged so the main booster and Solid Fuel Boosters both fire at launch. That usually gets me up to just below the upper limits of the atmosphere. Then I kick that off and use the nuclear engine with two smaller engines to help boost that out of the atmosphere. Then I shut off two fuel tanks and run the two smaller engines dry, kick them off and then I have two fuel tanks and a nuclear engine ready to go wherever it needs to. It can make it to the Mun just fine...haven't found out if it can get back yet...got to experiment with docking now...heh...heh...heh...:dead::dead::dead:

I've personally only used the cross feed method(usually use two rockets on the sides like the Aries-V rockets) but everyone swears by the Asparagus method on the forums. I was goin to use it with six rockets for my lander and any heavy lifting for space station parts.

One thing to remember, is to set the throttle level to the desired level before releasing the clamps. :haha:

...

Whoops!


http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/3651/whoopsie.jpg

Edit:
I tried the asparagus staging on the MunRocket and I saved a bit of fuel, surprised it worked for such a heavy payload with only 4 boosters. Thanks! :DL

Part of the reason it works is because the game calculates drag by piece, not based on whether or not they actually make head on air contact. This is why some wider rockets can function just as well or better than their skinny counterparts.

After reading about it, apparently the FalconX by SpaceX will use an asparagus like concept where all 3 engines will ignite, but the booster rockets will empty before fuel is drained from the center tank. NASA designs that feature all 3 engines igniting at once still have the center rocket burning its own fuel instead of cross feeding.

Speaking of aerodynamics, as they still need to work the aerodynamic model(will probably come when we get clouds) the nose cones don't really work. I believe they add a minimal a bit of lift, but add a fair amount of weight. If your ever pressed for fuel because of weight you should remove them. However, if you like the way rockets look(I like the nose cones) you can edit their config so they weight less.

Hmm I will have to try the asparagus stalk and let you know how it works.

What all mods have you guys got installed?

There is a list of suggested mods in the first post(although some of them are obsolete or out dated) if you would like some to look at. I'm personally using the 1.25M and 2.5M probe parts(ideal for unmanned space station control), Graphotron 2(gives you a use for your science sensors), and I'll probably be using the GPS mod(any probes with GPS in it's name and in a Geosynchronous orbit will act like a GPS satellite and give you GPS functionality on the planet).

I'm also using Payloader(lets you combine two rockets, ideal if you want to throw a certain payload onto a rocket you've already made).

Once it gets updated I plan on using the Truss mod for my deep space ships, and maybe pick up a rover mod(along with the airbag mods).

Edit: I may also use the ISA MapSat mod, lets you output maps in an image file from your Map Satellites. Just adds a use for Satellites. And Damned Robotics so I can have Robotic arms on my Space station.


Edit2: Apparently locking Gimbal on larger rockets helps rid them of their wobbliness.

Edit3: .18.1 Hotfix is out, but the server seems to be down.

:smug:

In their defense they broadcasted that the server was going to go down so they could upload the files. :O:

Edit: As I'm not entirely sure what time the forums use(might be GMT) I don't know what time he posted the message, and what time I read it. I know hen I had checked the forums earlier it wasn't there. I don't think we've managed to crash Amazons S3 servers... Yet.

Edit2: I stand corrected.
Although I don't know if that's Amazons side or theirs. I'd guess probably theirs.

I think we know who their technicians are:

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a1...behigha_03.png

If that's the case, the server has probably exploded.

Wow I may just have to try all of those out, I had damned robotics which was awesome and Sunday Punch which was as well and loved them both.

EDIT: SO the asparagus stalk worked but

A) the mainsail engine keeps taking out my smaller tank (I connect that between the orange one and the engine so it doesnt overheat so freakin quick

B) I am not getting enough fuel into orbit, maybe a quarter of what I had if Im lucky.

Just make the rocket 6 times bigger. Worked for Saturn V :hmm2:

Here's my jellynator, an almost ssto rocket, equipped with 24 LV-T45 and one Mainsal engine, four jumbo and 8 FL-T800 fuel tanks. It used to have eight radial engines around the mainsal but they overheated the mainsal and had a too low specific impulse.

http://i1049.photobucket.com/albums/...reenshot18.png

http://i1049.photobucket.com/albums/...reenshot19.png

My plan is to somehow attach (at least) three of those things together to create a lower stage for a ridiculously big cargo rocket to launch stuff towards other planets.


And here's my space station KOS. currently it has only three modules (living, core and electric) but I am slowly expanding it.

Living module connects with the core. The fastest (and first successful) docking I've ever made, only 34 minutes from launch to dock. Could have been done probably in under 30 minutes but I'm not too fast at docking.

http://i1049.photobucket.com/albums/...creenshot1.png

And the electric module, Jeb and Bob move to the station while Bill returns to kerbin. Crew now eight kerbals.

http://i1049.photobucket.com/albums/...creenshot9.png

(yes, I'm too lazy to convert the images to jpg)

The second Munar mission was a complete succes!

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...reenshot15.jpg
Rendezvous with orbiter after lifting off from the Mun.

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...reenshot16.jpg
Succesfully docked. This was followed by a quick lesson about center of thrust, and how it interacts with center of gravity. Pumped the fuel to the lander, ditched the orbiter and set off for home.

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...reenshot18.jpg
And got there too. Amazing.

With the Mun conquered without any effort at all (*cough*) it was time to set our goals further out. To Duna!

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...reenshot20.jpg
Encounter with Duna.

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...reenshot21.jpg
Slowed down enough for a proper orbit.

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...reenshot22.jpg
Pwetty.

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...reenshot24.jpg
To explore strange new worlds.
To seek out new dustballs and new oportunities for failure.
To boldly go where no probe has gone before.

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...reenshot23.jpg
To end up as a piece of space junk on a far away planet after a 216 day mission because of a minor slope. Who the hell engineered this thing?!

*reloads*

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...reenshot25.jpg
Better.

Made my first interplanetary missions. :rock:

Passing by Moho.
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/6780/passingmoho.jpg


2nd interplanetary probe mission.

Aerobraking at Duna.
http://img838.imageshack.us/img838/9...erobraking.jpg

In orbit.
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/6954/dunaprobe.jpg

http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__...is_Profile.png

I hate docking....

You know, one thing I've noticed in .18 is that it seems a lot more viable to build somewhat normally then .17 In .17 I had issues doing any missions beyond Kerbin orbit. In .18 it seems like you can build a lot more... normal?

I haven't done one asparagus design in .18 simply because you don't need to.

I have many launcher designs because of this experimentation and so far this has probably been my best one:
http://www.img.ie/i1eif.jpg

Its actually almost powerful enough to do Single-Stage-To-Orbit but runs out of fuel slightly before entering orbit which is actually a plus since I definitely don't want to be dragging that around in orbital maneuvers.