SUBSIM Radio Room Forums - [REL-UBM]Kriegsmarine AOB Finder

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- SH4 Mods Workshop (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/forumdisplay.php?f=219)

- - [REL-UBM]Kriegsmarine AOB Finder (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=135184)

Hitman

04-19-08 02:14 PM

Quote:

Edit - i did not realize the first time that you were speaking of U-boat's and not Fleetboats

Anyway the US subs had :

FOV was 32° and 8° not 38 and 9 - fleet type submarine manual pages 77, 443 and 526.

Thats a liner field of view of 419,44 feet pr. 1000 yards in high power (8° or x6 zoom) or 1677,76 feet in low power (32° or x1.5)

Apparently, there were more differences between US and german technology before WW1, but then the US submarine branch got much influenced by the superb technology they found in the surrended german U-Boats. Argonaut/Narwhal/Nautilus are a very close recreation of the WW1 german U-cruisers f.e. and in optics they also seem to have followed a lot of german ideas. Certainly, the double image stadimeter is a genuine US creation (Lt. Fiske, 1895) but the germans adopted it quickly and also used it for the AOB measuring. But other than that, the similarities are enormous, the US subs using however outdated WW1 german technology by 1942 in optics (No fixed heigth of eye periscope, no TBT/UZO until late 1943, etc.) , yet what they lost in that area they more than compensated in electronics (Radar and TDC mainly).

Jaeger

04-21-08 08:47 AM

hi mikhayl,

very nice job, indeed. but two questions: can you bring bak the aob wheel on the note panel? and second: would it be possible to add the tdc buttons in the attack scope?

greetz, Jaeger

akdavis

05-08-08 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by starbird

Apparently both the US and German stadimeters could be rotated 90 degrees, and used horizontally to find AOB? OLC mentioned it in his gui manual, and many have mentioned it in the sh4 forums.

It sounds to me that US and German boats had similar tools available, they just had different tactics for using them.

Just a confirmation, from Submarine Periscope Manual, Navpers 16165:

Quote:

4J1. General description. The periscope has an internal range finding device of the stadimeter type capable of giving both ranges and course angles. The change from direct observation to range reading or course measuring is quickly and positively effective.

The range and course-angle finding device is of the duplicate image type; the distance between the images may be varied at will, so that, for example, the water line of one image may be brought into contact with the masthead or funnel top of the other image. If the length of the vessel is known or estimated and set on the length of the target scale dial, the angle subtended is indicated in yards on the range scale dial, against the known height of the vessel on the height scale dial.

The device may be rotated 90 degrees in a plane normal to the optical axis of the periscope. This is done by continuing the clockwise motion of the operating gear beyond the limit of the vertical position of the separating mechanism; thus the whole divided lens unit rotates 90 degrees. In this position, the two images of the target are at opposite edges of the field and the mechanism is in contact with its stops. Turning the handwheel counterclockwise makes the two images approach each other. Since the known length of the target has been set on the length of target scale dial opposite the stationary index mark on the bottom of the stadimeter housing, when the bow of one image touches the stern of the other, the course angle is indicated on the length of target scale dial against the previously found range on the range scale dial.

Rockin Robbins

05-08-08 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikhayl

Updated 04-23-08
Corrected some mistakes (sorry for the crappy previous versions), put back the default AOB dial on the notepad and tweaked the cameras file (better external view and free interior cam).
_______________________________

That new version is for stock 1.5, resolution 1024*768, JSGME ready !

All credits go to Joegrundman, OLC and Hitman for the original idea/mods/graphics

files included :
-Joegrundman's .tgas for the AOB finder + bits of OLC's .tgas(slightly edited).

-stock menu.ini modified to have the AOBF when clicking on "angle on bow" on the attack scope notepad.

-stock dials.cfg with a single modification copied on OLC's GUI (commented in the file).

-stock cameras.dat file with these changes for both scopes : zoom levels 1.5x and 6x, FOV 85°.

-stock "names.cfg" file with all ships length added to read on the recon manual

-contline.dds, dashline.dd & torp.dds, which are now just an alpha channel, no more "tail" on contacts and no torpedo icon. Delete them before enabling if you want the icons back.

I suppose no much people use this stuff for SH4, so if one of you needs a specific version to be compatible with A, B or C mod, just send me your version of the files listed above, I'll apply the modifications and upload the JSGME ready version :up:

http://files.filefront.com/AOB+Finde.../fileinfo.html

Mikhayl, I squint in your general direction, sir! This is the most important addition to the U-Boat since the release of SH4UBM! Now we can all use authentic German methods of setting up an attack. This is utterly un-American and ingenius, showing German resoucefulness in the best light! Where we had fancy mechanical computer TDC's, the Germans came up with a much simpler, more elegant system that commands admiration if we will just use it!

This a first-rate contribution to SH4UBM and I wouldn't consider the U-Boat complete without it. Take a bow sir, and quit apologizing!:up:

Nisgeis

05-09-08 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

Now we can all use authentic German methods of setting up an attack. This is utterly un-American and ingenius, showing German resoucefulness in the best light! Where we had fancy mechanical computer TDC's, the Germans came up with a much simpler, more elegant system that commands admiration if we will just use it!

This is a very nice mod, very well done by Mikhayl, but it's not the way the Germans took their AOB readings. The OLC tutorial video posted in this thread says that they used a split image horizontal stadimeter to measure relative length and therefore AOB, but they couldn't work that into SH, so they used this method instead.

Hitman

05-09-08 08:11 AM

Quote:

They did have these wheels though, I suppose they could be used in "emergency" if the stadimeter didn't work, or even only to take a quick target speed reading. Hitman would sure know better, but I think these wheels may have been used on early u-boot (in Iron Coffins the author mentions two different types of attack scope mounted on the VIIC ?).

Yes they had, and they had them in fact since WW1. In the Vessikko scope you can still see the graded wiz-wheel system of the old scopes.

Werner refers in Iron coffins to two modesl of scopes, the first one is the older, classic one that goes up and down and is rotated manually. That one had the wiz-wheels externally. The second is the fixed-heigth-of-eye periscope that can be seen f.e. in the film Das Boot, where the commander sits in a saddle and operates the scope electrically, with no need to go himself up and down to his knees. This model had the same wiz-wheels and split prism system, but it was internal, being readed through the eyepiece in a partition.

Germans estimated the AOB as the americans, but mainly when being surfaced. Since the periscope makes you lose some of the depth-perception in objects, the wiz wheel served as an aid to determine AOB when doing a periscope attack. :up:

Nisgeis

05-09-08 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitman

Germans estimated the AOB as the americans, but mainly when being surfaced. Since the periscope makes you lose some of the depth-perception in objects, the wiz wheel served as an aid to determine AOB when doing a periscope attack. :up:

OK, I'm confused now. What's the OLC video talking about, when he mentions a split prism horizontal stadimeter?

Kapitan_Phillips

05-09-08 09:17 AM

Posted a link in the UBM mods thread for this :)

Hitman

05-09-08 11:10 AM

Quote:

OK, I'm confused now. What's the OLC video talking about, when he mentions a split prism horizontal stadimeter?

The split prism stadimeter was used first to determine the mast heigth (vertically) and then it was rotated 90º with a special handle to use it horizontally. The same split prism was used twice. :yep:

Nisgeis

05-09-08 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitman

Quote:

OK, I'm confused now. What's the OLC video talking about, when he mentions a split prism horizontal stadimeter?

OK, that's what I originally thought :D . Thanks for clarifying it. Do you (or anyone) happen to have any links to what the dial looked like for the German stadimeter?

Hitman

05-10-08 06:55 AM

Sure....here you go (Click on the image for larger version):

http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/734/wwheelfz1.th.jpg

joegrundman

05-11-08 08:34 AM

Hey Mikhayl

i really can't get this to download from your filefront - been trying a couple of days: could you possibly host it on mediafire too please?

joegrundman

05-11-08 09:07 AM

cheers:D

joe

Fish40

06-18-08 11:10 AM

Any chance of a version compatable with RFB 1.5? What about in higher resolutions? Really like this in SH3, and would love to use it here:yep: Thanks for any info.

rcjonessnp175

03-26-09 10:58 PM

Anynews on progress just started using this in sh3 with gwx3 and holy cow been missing out, just need this stuff in sh4 :wah:

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