View Full Version : K19 dubbed "Hiroshima" new pics
09-13-2005, 02:41 PM
in the mid 50's america launched nautilus this was the true begining of the undersea cold war now russia was to make her move and some of her moves were shocking.
in the late 50's the soviet union launched its 1st submarine K3 lennisky komsomol, she out classes nautilus in almost every way she was faster could dive deeper and carry more weapons (quoted from norman polmar).
along side K3 a new bread of submarine was launched K19 project number 658 NATO named HOTEL she was to be the first nuclear powerd nuclear missile submarine later called SSBN's.
russia had built the first submarine to carry ballistic missiles she was a converted zulu class known as zulu V by the west the first firing came in the mid to late 50's the first ever firing of a ballistic missile from a submarine was watched by admirals and chief of staff notibly premier Nikita Kreschev the submarines commanding officer was Victor Degyalo (his son is now an admiral in the navy)
"nikita kreschev came up to me he being shorter than i he embraced me kissed me and said you do not know what you have done for your mother land today you have done a great thing later i heard the chief of staff say you know when you fired that missile kreschev began dancing some old russian folk dance at that moment i knew this was the sign of things to come"
Admiral Degaylo in an interview (he was also command of a submarine squadron who he was in control of submarine K129 when she dissapeard in 1968
the K19 began her most ambitious exercise code named arctic circle she was under command of captain nikolai zatayev (who died in 1999 of cancer aged 61) all exercises and drill were going well and the captain pleased with his boat and its crew.
early hours of july 4th 1961 captain zateyev is woken in his cabin the nuclear reactor has failed few hours later he orders surface and to send a message to moscow but the anntenna has shorted and thier on thier own knowing a meltdown is highly possible zatayev orders men into the contaminated compartment
you know its not easy sending a man to his death
Captain zatayev shortly before his death.
all the men who went in to the compartment died with in days of returning home more die in the years following.
when K19 returned to base she contaminated everything within a 700 meter radius it took three years and a team of thousands to decontaminate and rebuild K19 for sea again fate would play again
in 1972 a fire broke out while K19 was at sea 28 men die as a result this fire was cause by a hydralics leak spreading toxic fumes and flames into the submarine.
again the boat was repaired and converted to fire missiles under the sea as a proper SSBN again another fire puts her out of action and when she returns she again is converted this time into a radar and comunications ship or SSQN
but yet again another fire breaks out no casualties are recorded but K19 is returned to service.
after the fall of the berlin wall and the collapse of communism the need for K19 deminished and in 1991 the submarine is finaly decommissioned after 30 years service.
most of her crew from the fateful 1961 voyage are among those at the attendance of the ceramony it wasnt only celebrating the decommissioning but also a reunion for the crew and a celebration of the fall of communist russia.
K19 finaly tied up in gremikha awaiting her fate many wanted her to be truned into a museam but it was never going to be in 2002 K19 was towed to the white sea and to a special dismantlement base where she was cut up and scrapped.
the K19 left behind many scars stories and memorys that will live on, her 41 years of existance proved that russia was so desperate to keep something that carried nuclear weapons at sea they went to extreme lengths to catch up with america.
K19 as she was in 1961
K19 after her rebuild and bough up to project 701 or HOTEL II standard
30 years of hard work misery and pain ends for K19 here she is moored at gremikha along side other submarines she waited here for 11 years untill 2002 when she was towed for scrapping
a hotel class being cut up possibly K19 but i dont know
09-13-2005, 02:44 PM
there is still two pieces left of K19 but who knows where they have got to
Interesting post Kaptain. What did you think of the movie btw? (Haven't seen it myself).
09-13-2005, 03:13 PM
i think it has some faults but over all a good watch i give it 7/10 few problems i noticed were.
a destroyer where the heck that come from ?
the captain shouting about he is a hero (something a captain would never do for fear of underminding the president)
the men being portrayed as drunks and incompatant (captain Igor Kurdin quoted from)
who was that girl who smashed the champagne bottle a common peasent :o some one high up in the offical party department or daughter of a central commitie member maybe but a peasent :o
the movie makes for good viewing and tells the story fairly accuratly the rest is the american portrayl of it i mean not many warships would want to get close to a russian submarine especialy in one of the biggest naval exercises of the year :o
09-13-2005, 03:59 PM
I've read a little bit about it, and I watched the movie. :roll:
There really was a destroyer "shadowing" the sub, just about the whole time it was underway. I think the reactor used plutonium, instead of U235, as it's fissile neutron source; there was the possibility of it generating a small nuclear explosion.
Coupled on top of that, they had a steam leak, and really did ship with chemical suits instead of radiation suits. I did some really crude calculations, given what little information I could find, and figured most of the reactor teams took in 5-8 Gy (Grays). One Gray is about the equivalent of 100 Rems (which, with neutrons and gamma radiation, is the equivalent of 100 Rads). Some lived for a couple of months, others expired within a week; a most unpleasant way to go out.
I kind of remember reading about a fire after it's refit, but didn't know about 2 or 3 subsequent fires. Run that damn thing out into the middle of the ocean and bomb it. That's crazy. Man, they totally weren't paying attention to detail when they slapped that boat together.
09-13-2005, 04:12 PM
for a start the nearst recorded NATO ship was over 300 miles away from K19
and a destroyer shadowingg through thick ice field geeeesss what was it an ice breaker as well ?
i doubt they would use plutonum also but im not a nuclear physasist
and it was catch up what you expect boat to sea first slapped together forget saftey just get it to sea thats the order of that day
09-13-2005, 04:36 PM
well, the crew (surviving) after even being consulted on the technial stuff, still sued the movie makers because of that 'drunken' portrayal of their behavior. Apparently a Russian must be drunk in order for a movie to sell to americans... However the way they portrayed radiation poisoning I heard was pretty realistic, only dumbed down for the viewing as not to completely gross out the viewer. Oh, and the RAASHAN AKSENT was classic, once again. I don't know the accuracy of the reactor problems, but also heard that way it was depicted was somewhat realistic.
6.5/10 as sub movie, and may be 7.5/10 as a general hollywood war drama for average joe.
09-13-2005, 06:18 PM
On 15 November 1969 K-19 collided with USS Gato (SSN-615) in the Barents Sea at a depth of 60 m (200 ft). She was able to surface by means of an emergency ballast tank blow. The impact completely destroyed the bow sonar systems and mangled the covers of the forward torpedo tubes. K-19 was repaired and returned to the fleet.
this one i forgot to mention
09-13-2005, 06:25 PM
a woman cant remember her name on the real K19 shortly before she was scrapped
captain 1st rank nikolai zatayev who would take the honour to be K19's first captain
vladimir yenin second in command of K19 (XO)
blue print of K19 and the hotel class project 658
09-13-2005, 11:07 PM
Very interesting. Thanks for sharing.
09-14-2005, 01:34 AM
lol got more but not now maybe some other time
09-14-2005, 01:51 AM
a woman cant remember her name on the real K19 shortly before she was scrapped I think that’s Catharine Bigalow the Producer of K-19: The Widowmaker.
the men being portrayed as drunks and incompatant A sailor drunk? Naw it can’t be! A sailor would never drink! When a sailor isn’t at sea he’s at home with his wife and kids or at church but never at a bar. :roll:
Listen when my dad was in the navy over at NAS Fallon he said the town was nothing but Bars and Whorehouses. A sailor reporting aboard hammered and broke isn’t with out precedent. :lol:
Oh and there is no shortage of stupid people in any military. :yep:
09-14-2005, 06:25 AM
eh... drunk during patrol is diffeent to being drunk on shore leave or hangover after returning from it.
I found this picture of it as well. Don't know what period it is though.
09-14-2005, 06:38 AM
its early probly mid 60's late 60's
09-14-2005, 08:12 AM
Yes, but is it after an accident? That tower looks destroyed on the back.
09-14-2005, 08:15 AM
could be after the collision with gato
09-14-2005, 02:12 PM
The Russian Submarine used for filming the movie was sold to a group in Rhode Island to be used as an exhibit.
The writer Tom Stoppard, as script doctor, did a re-write uncredited on the script.
The actual K-19 was a Hotel class Ballistic Missile Submarine. The Sub used in the movie is a modified Juliet Class Guided Missile Submarine. The Rescue sub in the film apears to be SSK 73 RCN Onondaga which was a Royal Canadian Navy Submarine of the Ojibwa Class (Improved British Oberon Class or Super O's) which was launched on September 25 1965 (4 years after the K-19 incident).
The Soviet sailors that survived the events depicted in this movie heartily approved of the director's take on it, but were amused by the "Hollywoodized" elements.
The submarine that ties up along side K-19 and rescues the crew appears to be an Oberon Class (British Royal Navy class name, may differ elsewhere) diesel submarine with the sonar dome near the bow removed.
Both the rescue sub and the American destroyer were former Canadian warships. The American destroyer was actually an 'Improved Restigouche' Class Canadian destroyer escort which was decommissioned in the mid-'90s. This class did not have a flight deck for a helicopter. Both ships used were stationed in Halifax, Nova Scotia, home of the Canadian Atlantic fleet. Halifax was used in shots of the K-19 departing for sea. In the background of that shot, Canadian warships can be seen.
Tonic water was used to simulate radioactive water in the reactor. The quinine in the tonic water made it glow.
Upon reading the film's script, the surviving crewmembers were so incensed that they sent an open letter to Ford, Bigelow, Whitaker, and Jaffe, expressing their dismay. Among the less-than-credible details they objected to were profane language, the animosity between the two highest commanding officers, insubordination among the crew, drunk crewmembers, the attempted mutiny, the guns (which are kept under seal in a secret location), and the handcuffs (which were only used by and available to cops).
The boat's real Russian nickname was Hiroshima.
K-19 suffered a fire in 1972 that killed 28 people.
In real life the K-19 was under the command of Capt. 2nd rank Nikolaj Zateev. The position of executive office was held by Capt.-Lt. Vladimir Yenin.
The rescue of K-19 was performed by the S-270 submarine under the command of Capt. 3rd rank Zhan Sebrilov.
In November 1969, the K-19 collided with the USS Gato (the latest USN attack sub at the time) at a depth of 200 ft, in the Barents Sea near Edge Island.
The submarine used in the film was once owned by a finnish businessman J. Komulainen and was open to the public. It also was used in a Finnish TV comedy "Vintiöt" (1994) in its opening sequence.
Natalia Vintilova has the only female speaking role in the whole movie.
09-14-2005, 02:22 PM
nikolai zatayev was a captain 1st rank as the soviets would never put a second rate or 3rd rate captain in charge of the newest submarine for fear of lack of experiance hence why the rescuing subs which were diesl were under command by younger less experianced and less ranked officers
jan svedelov was commander of S270 he was young infact a tad younger than zatayev
all the ships used in the film bar K19 were from canada K19 herself was played by submarin B414 now on display 9and she is sea worthey on all accords)
and the survivng crew sued the film makers for distorting the facts that dipect them as drunk and incompatent
the real K19 was towed to a scrap yard mid 2002 and scrapping began in 2003 its estimated the sub will be finaly dismantled by the end of 2005
09-14-2005, 02:49 PM
I hope they won the lawsuit.
09-14-2005, 03:11 PM
i think they did they had many many many people behind them including the internationaly recognised igor kurdin and many others including admirals and other high ranking officals
09-14-2005, 07:06 PM
Oops! sorry I forgot to mention the source of my C&P
Seems that I was misguided by them :yep:
If you can give me the source of your infomation then I will contact them and ask to change the information
09-14-2005, 09:02 PM
and the survivng crew sued the film makers for distorting the facts that dipect them as drunk and incompatent
Incompetent? I don't understand. When the hell did anything in the movie point to "incompetence"? Is this just a cultural thing? Like, the Russians felt they were being portrayed as incompetent?
Because I don't know of anyone that felt the crew were incompetent. I sure as heck didn't. I know people that felt the god damn Politiboro were incompetent, myself included, but not the crew.
Quite the contrary, in fact. It took metal balls just to watch the movie. Dunno what it took in real life, but it had to be something similar. Russians have always been hardcore...
09-15-2005, 01:29 AM
hard core maybe but even the hardest have feelings
i have a tape that talks about the true story of K19 and on that tape senior members of the admiralty (ret.) state this could damage the truth of the matter and be twisted causing us to look like idiots
its what they feel its something we cant see dont forget its them being portrayed not us
as for the captain no one in any mind would ever run around the boat screaming he is a hero the polit beureau staff would have him shot for treason and for underminding soviet influence and power
09-15-2005, 06:41 AM
The reason they may not appear incompetent to the outsider is because the Hollywood image of a russian navy men was always the same - they drink, they screw up at work, and than do heroic things to fix it. That's incopetent and stupid-brave. I would think that those who served in the Russian navy might have a different view.
09-15-2005, 07:47 AM
hollywood always portrays russians as:
this is why they are fighting for thier names the names which hollywood put a big slur on :(
09-15-2005, 08:01 AM
tycho, imagine that in all, say, french movies, americans were depicted as predominatly overweight. That's the kind of stereotyping of Russians they are fighting against.
Besides, if anyone's interested, Russia has always been a beer drinking nation up until the communist revolution. Beer drinking as Germany, and Scandinavia. Only after the revolution I've read that Vodka was a plan to be made much more 'available' as it was much better to dumb down the masses. I don't know how true that is, but a recent upsurge in Beer consumption and a steady decline in Vodka consumption in Russia has been partly attributed to that it's more natural 'alcoholic beverage' of choice for russians.
True or not - i don't know, but I found it very interesting. I personally always viewed vodka as low class.
09-15-2005, 08:10 AM
i dont drink beer vodka i do :stare:
09-15-2005, 08:12 AM
I don't drink, period. :up: My view on alcohol drinking is more of the exreme side, don't get offended. :|\
09-15-2005, 08:56 AM
lol im not your entitled to your opinion and me mine as it goes i dont drink that often even in the pub i dont drink often infact last time i had a vodka was about 3 weeks ago.
god dam it i need a drink :yep:
09-15-2005, 09:21 AM
Last time I had a drink was last f.... OH CRAP. :rotfl:
09-15-2005, 09:24 AM
lol what i do like about the movie K19 is that they do go to the real cematry where the crew is buried
did you know every body that was buried was put in a lead lined coffin and burried 12 feet down do avoid contaminating the entire cematry
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