Can't get away from the escorts during convoy attack....

[Skarmy]

I'm getting hammered by these 2 Japanese DDs, I'm playing TMO mod and the year is early 43.. attempting to attack a large convoy but can't get away :(

[Admiral Halsey]

I'm getting hammered by these 2 Japanese DDs, I'm playing TMO mod and the year is early 43.. attempting to attack a large convoy but can't get away :(

You using just TMO? If so the best thing to do is GO DEEPER!!

[merc4ulfate]

Depth?
Speed?
Battle Stations?
Repair Crew on?
Rigged for silent running?
Relative bearing fom convoy and escorts and exit heading?
Leaking Fuel?
Rear fish?

[Skarmy]

I can't shake these DDs for snot and they have a seemingly unlimited supply of depth charges.

[merc4ulfate]

Thank you for the information ... the data was most ... enlightening.

[Skarmy]

Silent running was on.. thermal layer was at about 130ft, I had silent running on, Battle stations active, I tried getting away various ways- but the way that ended up working was turning away immediately after launching torps and hauling butt away, surfacing when torps hit and landing a few 85lb shells on the destroyers to sink them.

[Admiral Halsey]

Silent running was on.. thermal layer was at about 130ft, I had silent running on, Battle stations active, I tried getting away various ways- but the way that ended up working was turning away immediately after launching torps and hauling butt away, surfacing when torps hit and landing a few 85lb shells on the destroyers to sink them.

Well there's your problem. You can't have battle stations on if you have silent running on since battle stations causes MORE noise then normal. Do that and go deep and you should shake them in no time.

[merc4ulfate]

"You can't have battle stations on if you have silent running "

Exactly.

[Armistead]

I haven't played in some time, but seems you could activate battle stations and silent running at the same time. As far as I recall the game doesn't hurt you if you have BS on, just that SR gives you more advantage.
Course mods vary...seems we argued before if BS was on with silent running had bad effect and Duci said no...

Anyway, escaping shouldn't be a problem, go deep and hit flank when they drop, after they explode, go back to silent running. The charges should fall behind you this way. Stay as narrow as possible to the nearest escort.

As far as your sub, when you try to attack, keep a narrow profile to the nearest escort, don't be broadside to one.

[7499275]

Speaking of going deep... What are max depths for the subs in SH4? Been so long since I played I don't recall.

[Father Goose]

I haven't played in some time...

That's most concerning. You need to get out from behind that desk Admiral. :O:

[THEBERBSTER]

I am using a Sargo so have 4 rear tubes.

I use these when taking on an escorted convoy from 3,000 yards.

This gives me a big advantage as I am already facing away from the escorts.

I can go deep and slip away at 1 or 2 knots.

If you have BS and SR on and then take BS off that bloody whistle and the shouting order kind of defeats the SR objective.

[Snarf]

Run Silent, Run Deep, Constant Helming. turn up the volume... when you hear the splashes, increase speed, hard rudder.

[Pisces]

Run Deep, Run Silent, Constant Helming. turn up the volume... when you hear the splashes, increase speed, hard rudder.Fixed that order for you. First slow and then deep doesn't make you move very far away from those depthcharges. It would take ages for you to get down there.

[merc4ulfate]

There is one issue with Battlestations. Your repair crew is actively making noise and I think the game simulates this with BS on. I have always noticed a correlation between being hear and being at BS.

When ever I am trying to get away I always turn BS off while running silent in order to stop the repair crew. Some mods reactivate the repair crew at BS even if you turn it off manually.

[jokker]

The moment your last torpedo leaves the tubes, hit crash dive + max power. Turn away and turn off Battle stations. Silent running should be on with the exception if your going to reload and try to get additional shots off. That's rarely the case so Silent on.

The escorts head for the beginning of the torpedo bubble trail is my observation. You want to clear the area of your firing as quickly as you can.

Crash dive puts max down angle along with max power. Click on depth gage to 250 ft or so or boat will stop at about 160 ft.. As escorts approach chop power. Usually you have some time for them to organize the search for you.

Track escorts with sound. As they approach go to engine off (or 1knot if you know how) and put some turn into boat to present small profile.

Go to map and put an X on escort position each 30 seconds or so. When the close in escort gives you his stern, bring boat up to 2/3 speed. Back to off if he turns back. When you have multiple escorts on you this can be tricky.

As stated before, if they drop over you hit power for a short burst. Apparently depth charges take some time to sink.

They will continue to work area of torpedo shot unless you give them a reason

[TorpX]

About this conventional wisdom of sprinting when you hear the ashcans splash; you are waiting too long.

If you are creeping along and don't accelerate until the charges drop, you will likely only get about 20 to 40 yards along before they explode. This isn't very much, and leaves you in the danger area. With some experience, you should be able to judge by the sound, when they are making a run on you, and get a head start. I think you should try to speed up and turn away from their run, at least 30 sec. to 45 sec. before they drop.

Realistically, a submarine just doesn't have the speed to successfully evade depth charges in the final 10 to 20 sec. drop time. If you don't agree, check the math. [Perhaps this has something to do with the large number of rudder casualties reported in this game.]

[magic452]

The best way to evade escorts is to avoid them. :know:

I'll track a convoy for as long as it takes to get in as good a firing position as possible, night, bad weather, etc. I set up at 2800 yards or more at a 70° attack angle if I can. Depends on which firing solution I'm using, TDC/PK or a zero gyro angle Okane or vector analysis.

If I'm using my bow tubes as soon as I fire the last one I go to full power astern and set depth to 300 feet or so. I'll back out for as long as I can and when the escorts get close cut to 3 knots, silent running and throw in about 15° rudder. This way you seem to get farther away from your firing position and still keep a low profile to the escorts. Haven't heard a close depth charge this whole career. :up::up:

Torpx is dead on about the flank speed timing thing. It takes some practice but can be done.
I will wait 30 or so seconds after they pass and cut to 1 knot and go to 15° rudder as well, you'll coast farther that way.

Magic

[Armistead]

And don't always think you can outrun them. Most the time they do attack from the rear and drop dead on you, that's why you can outrun them, but vet escorts do seem to time much better dropping them in front of you. I don't think any mod uses the elite crew rating, but I edited many to be elite and they attack from angles and often get way ahead of you, even had them make run in pairs. Just watch the Type A-D's escorts, they carry 6 Y guns and rolloffs and drop about 24 charges per run, so can be hard to outrun unless you're really deep. I don't make a hard turn when they drop, because often it puts you in the path of a Y gun charge, prefer a S turn of sorts, hard one way for about 5 seconds, then the other way for the same, then s8, it seems to put you between rolloffs and y gun charges. The Matsu is also a pain. Honestly, most the DD's in the game are pushovers, it's the DE's... You want a fight, go against 6 Type A's in 300 ft of water, charges sound like machine gun fire.

Research threads on evading escorts. They're numerous tactics to win against the meanest groups, but sometimes it's fun to cut those cams off and go in and see if you can live..

[Armistead]

The best way to evade escorts is to avoid them. :know:

I'll track a convoy for as long as it takes to get in as good a firing position as possible, night, bad weather, etc. I set up at 2800 yards or more at a 70° attack angle if I can. Depends on which firing solution I'm using, TDC/PK or a zero gyro angle Okane or vector analysis.

If I'm using my bow tubes as soon as I fire the last one I go to full power astern and set depth to 300 feet or so. I'll back out for as long as I can and when the escorts get close cut to 3 knots, silent running and throw in about 15° rudder. This way you seem to get farther away from your firing position and still keep a low profile to the escorts. Haven't heard a close depth charge this whole career. :up::up:

Torpx is dead on about the flank speed timing thing. It takes some practice but can be done.
I will wait 30 or so seconds after they pass and cut to 1 knot and go to 15° rudder as well, you'll coast farther that way.

Magic

Yea, if you're willing and have the time it's better to wait until night. Certainly if you can wait until you're in deeper water. One of these days I plan to try to finish a complete war with no saves, dead is dead...100% realism. I tried once and made it to early 45, but got killed being stupid in Formosa...

One thing fun with RSRD if you follow one convoy long enough, you'll almost always run into another. I often will stay in front tracking one and another one will pop up, then wait until they're almost together and attack. Often you can have 50 plus ships to choose from, but of course double the escorts....but so many overlapping targets. When I play serious, almost all my attacks are night surface, cept later war enemy radar can be fun to dance around...

Also learn to attack in storms, you can blast the hell out of everything with guns and torps...

[Sniper297]

I generally do the opposite of magic452 - get in close, the closer the better, 500 to 1000 yards off track inside the screen. When the first fish impacts I kick out a decoy and go to flank speed straight ahead, crossing under the convoy to the other side while heading down to 300 feet. After a few minutes I go to silent running still going straight ahead, by that time I'm about under the center of the convoy. Two advantages to that method;

1. The wakes, impacts, and decoy point to the attack coming from the port side of the convoy, I'm moving under it to the starboard side (or vice-versa).
2. If they do figure out where I actually am the risk of collision with the surviving ships in the convoy makes it more difficult for them to attack.

If they're cheating with the Psychic Friends Network I basically just endure, come up to periscope depth to kick out a decoy, turn 90 degrees and head for 300 feet at flank speed, then turn 90 again and go to silent running. As for the sprint, near as I can tell if you hear the ping you're detected, so there's no point in trying to be quiet. Might as well sprint to get out of the active semi circle, preferably in the opposite direction of the attack so you can come up in his wake baffles, kick out another decoy, then head for the deep and silent running again.

[merc4ulfate]

I do the same as sniper. Long distance shots are simply not my tactical favorite. I will allow the lead escort to pass and then I will come up in the middle of the convoy, in front of the convoy if the escort has gotten out to far ahead.

I attack and as soon as I fire I secure from silent running, order battle-stations, and move all ahead flank to the next target in order to have my range less than 1000 yards. Doing this means when they zig zag I have a better chance of hitting them.

The escorts now have to move around the merchants which slows them down while they look for me. Once the escorts are within 2000 yards of me I will go to as close to crush depth(NOT TEST DEPTH) as possible, order ahead 1/3 while we reload.

I will order a course to the weakest side of the convoy. If the escorts are mainly at 3,6,and nine o'clock I will head towards 12 o'clock. If they are at 1,5,7 I go to 10 o'clock.

I normally will get four ships either sunk or crippled this way and leave the convoy, surface out of range, reload from outer stores, move ahead of the convoy and strike again.

There have been times where I was judicious with my torpedoes and sank every ship in a medium sized convoy this way. Those that did not sink but were crippled I simply waited for the escorts to leave then sank them with the deck gun.

[aanker]

I learned evasion techniques in SH1 SHCE, for example, anyone remember the wagon wheel? Even Duci's DE is not that tough compared to going deep in that great DOS classic.

Happy Hunting! - (and evading : )