Anyone working on Atlantic Mod for 1.5?

[Dutch]

Hey I've looked around and I was wondering if anyone was working or thinking about working on an atlantic theater mod for 1.5. I like everything about SH4 but I don't want to buy the add-on unless I'm going to play in the atlantic with a U-boat. Its just personally preferance of course, I'm sure the game is good and I'm also certain that a mod of that caliber would be very difficult indeed, or maybe just switching something around I wouldn't know.

I would love to see SH3 in the SH4 engine. Then this truly would be the greatest of all subsims. The pacific for players who like playing the americans. The atlantic for those who would enjoy the germans.

[JU_88]

Its a MAJOR task - but it almost sure to happen, I think thats why the Devs put the Uboat missions addon out - just there little way of laying the foundations for modders so to speak.

[bigboywooly]

Porting of SH3 to SH4 wont be quick
Will take a fair bit of time
Plenty to do

[Factor]

i didnt think i would like the indian ocean operations either. im pretty much hooked right now.

[Rockin Robbins]

You are the loser here. SH4UBM should be lame. It should be no fun. It sounds like a complete abortion. Explanations of the features leave you convulsed with laughter. There's nothing you want in the add-on.

Until you play it!

Try it, you'll like it. There is some unidentified potent addictive drug in there!:arrgh!:

[Wilcke]

Better than Disneyland?

[Factor]

better than disneyland on acid imo. well, maybe.

[Dutch]

Well sounds like you guys got it pretty bad here, I'm afriad I would have withdrawls from SH4 TM/RSRD/NSM if I tried something new, or possibly have an adverse reaction and be addicted to both, it has been seriously detremental to my relationship with my significant other.

No doubt that porting it would be a task indeed. But thats what was said about GWX if I remember. I know it can be done but I'm just having so much with SH4 1.4 that I just can't tear myself away. I'm guessing you can't but 1.5 in stores? I've looked but have not seen it. Don't trust the whole D2D if my hd fails I have to buy it again. But I will continue my search and maybe in a few months once I pull myself from 1.4 I will upgrade!

[AVGWarhawk]

You need to upgrade now. The fleet boats got some new stuff and of course the uboats are now there. The game plays much better and has improved quite a bit in this area. For $10.00 you can not go wrong. Make two installations....original SH4 and then the add on installation. I recommend you get the add now anyway as TMO/RFB and all the other mods are heading towards 1.5 compatiblity.

[Pikes]

I know exactly what you mean about the Atlantic theme. But the game is awesome anyway, there are so many touches that are better. One day we may have both...

[Hartmann]

Its a MAJOR task - but it almost sure to happen, I think thats why the Devs put the Uboat missions addon out - just there little way of laying the foundations for modders so to speak.
Yes i´m agree with this.Devs give to the community the "how to" in one of the most diffficults parts of the future mod, the U-Boats adaptation, targeting, textures, interiors, crew...The next os a huge task, but comparable with GWX, and it can be done.What´s the next ? campaing layers, allied units, ports, interface changes, playable fast boats...(in the pacific too ) ....

[Skyhawk]

Hey I've looked around and I was wondering if anyone was working or thinking about working on an atlantic theater mod for 1.5. I like everything about SH4 but I don't want to buy the add-on unless I'm going to play in the atlantic with a U-boat. Its just personally preferance of course, I'm sure the game is good and I'm also certain that a mod of that caliber would be very difficult indeed, or maybe just switching something around I wouldn't know.

I would love to see SH3 in the SH4 engine. Then this truly would be the greatest of all subsims. The pacific for players who like playing the americans. The atlantic for those who would enjoy the germans.

It's a given that SOME here at the subsim forums will have, and express, the opinions stated in the replies to the op thus far. So, I will ask one of the original questions posed by "Dutch" in much the same way . . .

Is there anyone out there, who is CURRENTLY working on a conversion of SH3 (with SH4 graphics) or who personally knows of someone else that is?

The question is pretty much a simple one. Any of the following will do if an elaboration on a straight up "yes or no" is felt necessary. . .

"Yes, I am currently working on an SH3 conversion."

"Yes, I personally know of someone who is currently working on an SH3 conversion."

"No, I am not myself, nor do I personally know of, anyone who is currently working on an SH3 conversion."

Of course elaboration and opinions are all fine and well, this is a forum. :yep: But how about answering the original question? :hmm:

Enquiring minds want to know. Why the need for all the tap dancing?

No doubt it will be a "big job". But the longest journey begins with a single step, so, has anyone gotten started on this beast????? Anybody personally know of anyone who has????? :hmm:

I would have thought that someone amongst those who adamantly justified the Uboat addon because of the SH3 conversion possibility it would provide (among other possibilities as well) would have been chomping at the bit to get started. :hmm:

If I may quote another subsim member anonymously, "Just saying . . ." :know:

[AVGWarhawk]

Is there anyone out there, who is CURRENTLY working on a conversion of SH3 (with SH4 graphics) or who personally knows of someone else that is?


Simple answer, yes! Someone is working on SH4UBM but, conversion of SH3 is not part of it.

[Rockin Robbins]

Yes I personally know someone is working on SH4UBM but although the Atlantik will be recreated in different and superior manner to SH3, he is not reinventing the wheel and the Atlantik will only be a prelude to the misery to follow.

That is really what you seek in a slavish recreation of Sh3, something already done, right? Truly creative people are never happy merely copying the mistakes of the past. SH3 will not live again in SH4 clothing.:up:

Just know that people with better imaginations and abilities than us are working on something you don't know you want yet. Think "google"

[GlobalExplorer]

Porting of SH3 to SH4 wont be quick
Will take a fair bit of time
Plenty to do

Bbw, do you think an automated conversion of SHIII to SHIV could work? Of course Unit types would have to be replaced, but did Ubi make changes to the geographic data / coastlines or would the ships end up in the right spots?

Of course I am only talking about the .mis files - not 3d models and other things that cannot be easily converted.

[GlobalExplorer]

Yes I personally know someone is working on SH4UBM but although the Atlantik will be recreated in different and superior manner to SH3, he is not reinventing the wheel and the Atlantik will only be a prelude to the misery to follow.

That is really what you seek in a slavish recreation of Sh3, something already done, right? Truly creative people are never happy merely copying the mistakes of the past. SH3 will not live again in SH4 clothing.:up:

Just know that people with better imaginations and abilities than us are working on something you don't know you want yet. Think "google"

In 95% of cases what you just said is bull****. Only in some exceptional cases you are right. The term "reinventing the wheel" does not exist for nothing, and everyone who worked on software projects knows what I mean.

[CaptainHaplo]

Look - it drives me nuts to see this continually thrown out here - and by a number of folks I respect from my SH3 days. As much as some people are going to hate it - accept the fact that SH3 is not and could not stay the "Premier" submarine simulation for all eternity. Instead of all this "Atlantic" vs "Pacific" nonsense, lets realize that everyone has a "theatre of operations" they like over the other. Just because some may like the Atlantic more, doesn't mean that SH4 is not a superior "game" in technical aspects. SH3 will NOT be "ported" to SH4 - simply because SH3 data, while a FOUNDATION for things in SH4 - is not really compatible with the extra thing that the sh4 engine added.

Ultimately, SH3 (and the GWX 2 mod data) will ultimately help shape the way any SH4 Atlantik mod is done - and that is a credit to both the devs and modders of SH3. And who is to say that Ubi won't decide to develop SH5 (or another SH4 expansion) in the Atlantic. After all - with SH3 - thats how we learned there would be an SH4.

This back and forth on "porting" sh3 into sh4 seems more like a turf war between people than it does about the greatness of both SH3 and SH4. They both aim to simulate WW2 submarine warfare, and they both due an admirable job of it within the technical limitations each has. Can they be improved - of course. Especially SH4, since it has not had the "maturation" time that SH3 has.

Yes, Sh4 is an evolutionary product of SH3 - and a new atlantic campaign via mod or expansion would be an evolutionary product of SH4 - but that doesnt mean that such a campaign would be SH3 in SH4 clothing. SH3 got a lot of things right, but it also had alot of room for improvement. If it didn't, why was GWX created? Anyone who has played GWX vs stock will tell you that its almost 2 seperate games! The same applies for SH3 and SH4 - and thus a SH4 Atlantic mod/expansion will be the same - a different game. In fact, playing the UBM is a different game than it is when playing fleetboats. *Again, if it wasn't, why make it?*

Ultimately, alot of folks are working on an "Atlantic" mod - even if they don't know it. Everything from adding bases, tweaking sensors, ships, and everything else modders can do will contribute to such a mod. It may not be fully defined as a project yet, then again, it might. RR indicates it is and I have no reason to doubt him.

But let's stop the SH3 to SH4 conversion talk - it won't work. Nor would GWX port. And there is no reason to have to ***** out words, take a deep breath and lets not get too sensative - we are all among friends. Its ok to disagree, but be decent about eh, old chap?

[Mikhayl]

I don't think that's such a big deal, the word "conversion" is quite wide.
SH3 and SH4 are different but the Atlantic was is still the same, when people talk about conversion it's (IMO) about porting the truly great and torough work of a few people on the SH3 campaign into the SH4 layers, with as much additions as the new engine permits.
It's not really about "porting SH3" but really about porting as much as the atlantic as possible for those (like me a bit) addicted to that theatre.
Peace :)

[bigboywooly]

Porting SH3 to SH4 doesnt mean transplanting it lock stock and barrel in SH4
Noone said it was to be that way
Tis ppls perceptions

From my GWX POV it means porting the GWX ideals\features and innovations
Sure, things will not be exactly the same and in most cases new
Who wouldnt want to make the most of the game engine ?

Yes work has already begun in a couple of places as RR said and no doubt more will spring up
From my own limited delve into the campaign side of things there are more opportunities than SH3 could have given us and most people will take advantage of that

Having said all that SH3 remains top of my playlist - newer game engine or not
Has a certain feel to it that SH4 doesnt replace
Even with being able to start in the Atlantic ports ;)

[Rockin Robbins]

Yes I personally know someone is working on SH4UBM but although the Atlantik will be recreated in different and superior manner to SH3, he is not reinventing the wheel and the Atlantik will only be a prelude to the misery to follow.

That is really what you seek in a slavish recreation of Sh3, something already done, right? Truly creative people are never happy merely copying the mistakes of the past. SH3 will not live again in SH4 clothing.:up:

Just know that people with better imaginations and abilities than us are working on something you don't know you want yet. Think "google"
In 95% of cases what you just said is bull****. Only in some exceptional cases you are right. The term "reinventing the wheel" does not exist for nothing, and everyone who worked on software projects knows what I mean.

Watch and learn. Wonderful things are happening.

[JScones]

Frankly, I don't care who develops such as mod as long as it's historical, immersive and enjoyable...and doesn't come with a truckload of baggage. ;)

I think only the very literal or imaginative will take terms like "conversion" or "porting" to mean "cut and paste" or "SH3 is better than SH4 and we will turn SH4 into SH3 and make you all suffer".

But who cares? Won't any conversion of SH3, or for that matter GWX, WAC, NYGM, LSH3 etc be just another option for players to try? Sure, if the dev teams converted verbatim with only the edges filed to make it fit, I'd be disappointed. But that just means that I, and anyone else who feels that way, would try one of the other mods and then settle on the one we like best. Certainly a mod that takes advantage of SH4, is fresh and utilises SH4 to its maximum potential would appeal to me more than a flat transfer, which TBH I'd just see as lazy.

But somehow, at least as far as GWX is concerned, I don't think the modders would just do this - just look at the occasional posts on this forum from GWX developers that show that they're investigating the SH4 structure behind the scenes. BUT, history hasn't changed since SH3 was released, so why wouldn't they use what they've already researched as a basis? And why wouldn't they use their SH3 modding experience? I know I certainly would. Just because it was applied to SH3 does not make it irrelevant.

At the end of the day players will determine how popular any "conversion", or perceived "conversion" from SH3 is. So I don't understand why people here, ironically SH4 loyalists, get so protective about it. I'm aware of at least three "teams" doing Atlantic work for SH4 and a few individuals working on components that will undoubtably connect up to something larger at some point. In the end, I'll choose the mod I like best, regardless of who created it. Viva la choice. :up:

[Skyhawk]

For the record, the only reason I wrote my reply the way I did was to hopefully prompt some straightforward answers. Which I did, so in that regard "mission accomplished".

Definitely WAS NOT my intention to stir up any of that Atlantic/Pacific "whatever you want to call it" b.s.

I knew the answer to the question before I replied. Just thought it might have more meaning if some of those who had previously responded came back and answered the original question in a more straightforward way.

So, to all those who are submersing themselves in their bathtub and holding their breath while the SH3 to SH4 graphics engine conversion is released, time to surface! It's not going to happen!

And also for the record:

If I want to play a simulation of commanding a Uboat in the Atlantic, I play SH3 w/GWX.

If I want to play a simulation of commanding a Fleetboat in the Pacific, I play SH4 w/TMO.

The two things above are enough for me. I appreciate both of them for what they are and for the work that went into creating them.

Fantasy, "what if" scenarios, or over glorified mods of minor aspects of WWII submarine warfare, well I leave those to others. They are not my cup of tea and it doesn't bother me in the least if there are those who enjoy them. To each their own.

Whatever sim/mods you choose to use, have fun. And fun isn't had by sitting on your hands waiting for something better to come along when something of quality is right in front of you waiting for you to double-click that desktop icon!

As you were . . .

Back to silent running . . . :lurk:

[FloydRoses]

In shortly......
nobody can't build sh3 mod for sh4.....false
nobody does not WANT build sh3 mod for sh4....its TRUE!

Sorry for my English.

[Rockin Robbins]

Shows that the acrimony comes from Skyhawk and Global explorer, not the SH4 "loyalists." Having some ties both to SH4 and SH3 modders, let me lay it out in neutral terms:

1. Anyone who thinks the GWX team is just going to build the evil cross-compiler that ports everything they've done over to SH4 doesn't know the GWX team. They would never contemplate that at all! They are creative people. Creative people create new things, not duplicate old things. I am not saying that they won't use what they have already learned. I'm saying they will build on the past, not copy it. Anybody have a problem with that? Too bad. The GWX team is what it is.

2. SH4 modding teams are more familiar with the toyz in the SH4 game engine, but the new stuff in SH4UBM is new to everybody. Hint: you don't see any SH4 modders posting in this thread. Could it be that they are very busy? They also are creative people. I can't see them copying any GWX work. Neither can I see the GWX team copying anybody else's work.

So regardless of the source, what we will get is new. SH3 will not be reborn in SH4. Gee! I think I said that before and somebody said that what I said was mostly bulletin. I still don't know what a bulletin has to do with anything.:88)

Please, folks, don't mistake the blatherings of GWX and SH4 modder cheerleaders for statements from the modders themselves. They are too busy to talk. And wonderful things are happening.:sunny:

[Dowly]

EDIT: Nevermind, I cant read. :)

[GlobalExplorer]

Shows that the acrimony comes from Skyhawk and Global explorer, not the SH4 "loyalists." Having some ties both to SH4 and SH3 modders, let me lay it out in neutral terms:

1. Anyone who thinks the GWX team is just going to build the evil cross-compiler that ports everything they've done over to SH4 doesn't know the GWX team. They would never contemplate that at all! They are creative people. Creative people create new things, not duplicate old things. I am not saying that they won't use what they have already learned.

Unexperienced people start things they cannot finish. I bet 90% of all mods in the works at this moment will either not be finished, obsolete when they are released, unuseable or incomplete. Because people don't listen to advice, start with the easy things, start making things that have been done better before, dont team up, etc.

We are reaching a point where it sucks to find the mods that we will play in between the ones that we will never play (think of other games modded to death such as Morrowind or the TW series). I guess you need not look further if you want to know the reason for the success of GWX - it is a finished product, not just a young mans dream.

Before you interpret more into my owrds than necessary: I was only suggesting that it might be a good idea to write a program that ports over the campaign data from GWX to SHIV (and in my weak moments I have even considered doing that myself). Why not use the quality we have from SHIII as a base and start the real work on top of it? No, of course, creative people are so awesome they know it's better to always start everything from scratch! Believe me dude, I've seen this enough in software projects, and it's one of the main reasons for lack of quality and direction in software products.

And before I get accused of acrimony again, I am looking forward to play any Atlantic mod for SHIV, no matter how it was created or by who.

[Rockin Robbins]

I just don't think the GWX team will be satisfied with that. I predict we hear very little from GWXers. When we do it will be upon release of a new product. Then we will be very surprised what we get. They would quit before they rested on their laurels.

And SH3 is not a dinosaur. It is a great game that doesn't need to be ashamed because of SH4. It's not like they're abandoning a sinking ship. Just check out the traffic on the SH3 forums and tell me if that's a dead duck!

And I think we are hearing very little from the SH4 modders for the same reason. They will let their work do the talking while we argue about it all. Then we will find all our arguments were irrelevent and we were worried about things that were never going to happen.

Isn't that the way life usually works out?:up:

[Elder-Pirate]

If only this Lady were here maybe we could have our cake and eat it to. :lol:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y116/oleman/Bewitched.jpg

[CaptainHaplo]

My post was also not meant to be inflamitory - both SH3 and SH4 are great. Straight "porting" - moving data over and running with it won't work, but as I said - the lessons learned and data uncovered in things like GWX WILL make whatever is the final product that much better! There are those that proclaim GWX the end all be all - but I can tell you its not the makers of it! Nor is SH4 - now will it ever be. As time progresses things will simply get better - and we will have all the modders from both sides of the equation - to thank for it.

[GlobalExplorer]

And I think we are hearing very little from the SH4 modders for the same reason. They will let their work do the talking while we argue about it all. Then we will find all our arguments were irrelevent and we were worried about things that were never going to happen.

That would really surprise me, because it would mean SHIV modders are a special breed. Usually modders have a nasty habit of announcing their project the very day they started with it, no matter if they can finish it.

Personally I believe the silence means that SHIV modding has not really taken off yet. The old faces from SHIII are tired and returning to rl, the new ones are still playing (maybe that is the best thing, that people still enjoy the game). I do however expect that we will see great mods, as the mod friendliness of the SH engine is still there.

[LukeFF]

Personally I believe the silence means that SHIV modding has not really taken off yet.

You couldn't be farther from the truth with that statement.

[AVGWarhawk]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins
And I think we are hearing very little from the SH4 modders for the same reason. They will let their work do the talking while we argue about it all. Then we will find all our arguments were irrelevent and we were worried about things that were never going to happen.

Globalexplorer

That would really surprise me, because it would mean SHIV modders are a special breed. Usually modders have a nasty habit of announcing their project the very day they started with it, no matter if they can finish it.


Do you spend much time in the SH4 mod forums? Why is it a nasty habit to announce a mod in the making? Makes for good conversation and generally helps the creater if he gets stuck. Or in some cases, dies in the process (rest in peace Dave Bunell) or in the case of RFB left by Beery to be picked up by Swdw and is now a team of guys beta testing the next installment as I type this.

Personally I believe the silence means that SHIV modding has not really taken off yet. The old faces from SHIII are tired and returning to rl, the new ones are still playing (maybe that is the best thing, that people still enjoy the game). I do however expect that we will see great mods, as the mod friendliness of the SH engine is still there.


No it sure has not taken off. I will be sure to tell the following creaters of these mods:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=108964

Large list huh? So, were is the part were the modding has not taken off?


Do you realize the Skwajers 3D Modding Tool makes just about everything a snap now? From what I gather, the dreaded Hex Editing with this tool makes life vastly simplier.

Please give some credit were credit is do to the fellas on the list located in the link above. In just over a year, 5 major mods have come together as 2 large mod packages. TMO, ROW, MSN, RSRD and RFB. The mods contain playability, historical traffic, realism and an environment mod that is out of this world. Contained within these mods are numberous smaller mods creating a great game.

I'm sure you will enjoy the German boats in SH4 again and very soon :yep:

[Skyhawk]

RR. Amazes me how quickly you went from a misinterpretation of my intent to applying an erroneous label.

My only intention was to make the point that we should have fun RIGHT NOW with what we have rather than fuss about what might be and doesn't exist yet.

That's ok, no worries, I understand how enthusiasm can get in the way of judgement sometimes. We all make mistakes. :yep:

Believe me, if I was trying to be acrimonious there would be no doubt in anyone's mind about it and I would most likely find myself banned in very short order.

The thing we ALL have to realize is that our opinions all cost the same and so long as they are expressed in a respectful and non-derogatory manner it's within the forum rules to make such posts.

Go back and read my replies again, I clearly express appreciation for SH3, SH4, and their respective "supermods", and deliberately expressed appreciation for the work that went into creating them.

Back to my place with the rest of the silent majority . . . :roll:

[Ducimus]

Personally I believe the silence means that SHIV modding has not really taken off yet.

You couldn't be farther from the truth with that statement.

You know that, I know that, alot of Pacific/Fleet boat fans know that. But for some people, if its not Uboats with GWX stenciled on it, it doesnt exist. If ignorance is bliss, theres some really happy folks out there.

[JREX53]

You know this topic about an Atlantic Campaign has come up about 5 times now
since the addon has come out. Doesn't anybody do a search anymore.
This forum isn't that old.
Somebody starts up a new thread about this then somebody says something
stupid and the other side takes offense to what is said.
GlobalExplorer have you had your head stuck somewhere for the last year.
The SH4 modders have been doing excellent work making very good mods.
They have a lot better handle on this game then you think they do.

[Wilcke]

You know this topic about an Atlantic Campaign has come up about 5 times now
since the addon has come out. Doesn't anybody do a search anymore.
This forum isn't that old.
Somebody starts up a new thread about this then somebody says something
stupid and the other side takes offense to what is said.
GlobalExplorer have you had your head stuck somewhere for the last year.
The SH4 modders have been doing excellent work making very good mods.
They have a lot better handle on this game then you think they do.

Thank you! Its a great time to be patrolling in a Fleet Boat. For many of us its a dream come true!

[GlobalExplorer]

Why is it a nasty habit to announce a mod in the making? Makes for good conversation and generally helps the creater if he gets stuck.

Depends on what you mean. Whether the point is to announce an idea, ask questions, gather ideas / support / or if the point is to discuss something that will never exist. I am annoyed by the half finished jobs, especially because these are the ones that create the most noise. If you're happy with seeing the same things repeat over and over again, that's your problem. I am not, and I am prepared to piss off some ppl because of that.

My comments are not directed on SHIV modders , but on modders in general. Since the exciting start in the 90s, it has now become much more difficult to get enjoyment out of mods, which mostly results from the fact that modders refuse to organize their work somewhat professionally (professionally as the GWX team did - hence the satisfaction with GWX).

If not someone finds a way to give it direction, modding will turn into a gigantic waste of time - for the users and the creators - look at other games like the TW series to see what I mean. Mods, mods, mods. Each does something better, but other things worse - but they can be made compatible if you follow these 20 simple steps - ah the decisions! Wonderful.

I don't mind if this pisses off some people. Imo sooner or later you will realize that this is really becoming a problem.

Plz take it easy.

[ReallyDedPoet]

I actually think that modding is in great shape. Having played SH4 since 1.0, I have seen a real spirit of cooperation amongst modders all in the spirit of making the experience a better one. As well, some of the modders have be tweaking the game from the very beginning, quite an accomplishment given the fact that there have been patches to 1.4 and an add on. If anything we should be giving them all medals rather than asking them to do even more.

Thus if the above is happening, then those of us using the mods should
do our part by:

- Reading documentation that comes with the mod. This in itself would make many folks very happy. If one researched some of the older threads\posts, you would find they could have been avoided by simply looking at the mod read-me.
- Researching the mod's thread a bit to find out about compatibility
with other mods, etc.
- Using the search option. I can handle newer players not doing this, but when
folks who know better post something like " I would search for this but I am to lazy, or I did not want to read the thread ( even parts of it ) ". Many answers for existing questions are in older threads.
- Folks starting new threads with questions rather than posting that question in the original thread.
- Asking questions in away that people will respond to.

I don't mod ( except for a few unofficial tweaks, and a little mod I released at Christmas :D ) but SH4 would have been shelved long before this if not for the great work here done by modders. I don't expect them to do it all, in fact if they are doing there part then I will do mine by paying attention to what's going on in the modding scene and if I can, figure stuff out on my own. It's my way of giving back to a great, great community.


RDP

[Uber Gruber]

We're sorry to have to interrupt this program to make the following important announcement:

Due to a sudden escalation in violent incidents between the Pacifico and Atlantico sub gangs, and following reccomendations from the Lord Chief Justice and a recent home office review, the government has unanimously decided to reclassify submarine simulations as Class A simulations. Consequently, anyone found in posession of a submarine simulation will face prosecution, a 2000 pound fine and risk a custodial sentence of up to 3 years. Anyone found supplying submarine simulations will be castigated....which is very painfull indeed.:doh:

Good evening. :arrgh!:

[Gezoes]

So... who is doing what for wich game now that SH4-Uboats is out.

I can't stand the tension! :rotfl:

"Wonderful things are happening..."

Give us a hint! :hmm:

[Kapitan_Phillips]

We're sorry to have to interrupt this program to make the following important announcement:

Due to a sudden escalation in violent incidents between the Pacifico and Atlantico sub gangs, and following reccomendations from the Lord Chief Justice and a recent home office review, the government has unanimously decided to reclassify submarine simulations as Class A simulations. Consequently, anyone found in posession of a submarine simulation will face prosecution, a 2000 pound fine and risk a custodial sentence of up to 3 years. Anyone found supplying submarine simulations will be castigated....which is very painfull indeed.:doh:

Good evening. :arrgh!:

The Home Office holds no sway here, I have DOMINION.

http://www.arnoldspeaks.com/uploaded_images/Arnold-729326.bmp

[TDK1044]

I've never really understood the unnecessary tension between Silent Hunter III and Silent Hunter IV on the subject of modding.

Both games were released in an unfinished state. Both games needed significant patching and modding, and both games got significant patching and modding. The end result are two excellent subsims that continue to grow.

As someone who is not capable of modding in any shape or form, but who happily uses the excellent mods offered, I salute all the modders on both games.

I'm looking forward to having a U Boat Atlantic campaign within Silent Hunter 1V, but as I have no interest in U Boats in the Indian Ocean, for now I'm running 1.5 but only using the Pacific campaign.

[danlisa]

I've never really understood the unnecessary tension between Silent Hunter III and Silent Hunter IV on the subject of modding.

Because everyone on the SH3 side is ignorant.

But for some people, if its not Uboats with GWX stenciled on it, it doesnt exist. If ignorance is bliss, theres some really happy folks out there.

[skwasjer]

Maybe I should just ban SH3 and U-boat modding from S3D, see how the dogs bark then... :rotfl:

j/k ;)

[M. Sarsfield]

Crow would be for dinner.

[Dowly]

Personally I believe the silence means that SHIV modding has not really taken off yet.
You couldn't be farther from the truth with that statement.
You know that, I know that, alot of Pacific/Fleet boat fans know that. But for some people, if its not Uboats with GWX stenciled on it, it doesnt exist. If ignorance is bliss, theres some really happy folks out there.
If one does like only Uboats, naturally they want a mod that suits them. And most ppl who like Uboats, prefer the Atlantic as their operations area. There's (i think) 2 teams that have said they are doing an Atlantic mod for SHIV. Aces of the Deep & GWX (Or is Atlantic Sharks still doing theirs?).

And as for ppl who only talk about SHIV GWX, can you blame them? GWX is and was a huge mod and very popular for SHIII, naturally ppl will remember it. I know it's not fair for the other teams, but can you blame the GWX team of what the users think about it?

[Rockin Robbins]

Competition makes everybody better. Coopetition works even better. Both will happen and we will be the winners.

I'm still working on that "most of what I say is bulletin" statement. Research has failed to provide any leads...:rotfl:

[Ducimus]

I've never really understood the unnecessary tension between Silent Hunter III and Silent Hunter IV on the subject of modding.

Because everyone on the SH3 side is ignorant.

But for some people, if its not Uboats with GWX stenciled on it, it doesnt exist. If ignorance is bliss, theres some really happy folks out there.


Wasn't my intention to be so blunt, but i guess your right, thats what i was saying. So, i might as well step up to the plate..

yes, theres a lot of ignorance coming from the SH3 folks.

1.) This whole "I like one side and the other is a bunch of crap" mentality is old, and gets on everyones nerves. I sometimes cope the same attitude back, but only as a response to the original prodding.

2.) In relation to point 1, a lot of people here play uboats exclusively, and are too ignorant to "Expand their horizons" (:roll: ). They'll talk a lot of smack about something they know nothing about. Personally, i didn't want to play another uboat game in SH3, but i got informed on it anyway. I probably know as much about uboats as i do about fleetboats (if not moreso). I can't say others here on subsim are as open minded.

3.) Comments like "the modding hasn't taken off yet", In any context, get on alot of peoples nerves as well. Particuarlly when youve spent 4 or 5 hours on the game every night, or every other night, for months now. The proof that the modding has taken off is in the work thats been published, the highlights are too numberous to list. Right now im sitting on two updates to TM that i havent posted yet. When people imply nothing has been done for modding, the kneejerk reaction is "hmm gee, WTF have i been doing for months now?!"

Which i guess leads into another point. Bragging. For the most part, folks don't do too much of that here. At least, not in a fashion to say, "look how much better my mod is over the other ones!". The modding community here is not the cutthroat compedative world that SH3's was, (or is? :hmm: ), but an open source, collaborative effort. So your not going to see a whole lot of , "Sneak peek" posts.


At any rate, im tired of all this. I dont expect the ignorance level to change here anytime soon. So all im trying to do now, is finish my work so i can back away from all of this crap. I'll have my game that ive been waiting 12 years for, and to me, thats all that matters in the end - not the typical subsim.com school yard antics.

[GlobalExplorer]

3.) Comments like "the modding hasn't taken off yet",

I was the one who made that statement, and it was stupid. Ok? If I was in your shoes I would be pissed off too.

But it was never meant that way. The thread has meandered and I was actually responding to a statement of RR that it is quiet in here because SHIV modders are too busy.

And besides I really don't see much of a confrontation. It was only by the reactions to my postings in this thread that I noticed something might be wrong. I am really only postponing SHIV because I need better hardware, and I am looking forward to using TM / RW, and the other SHIV goodness.

And I wanted to let off some smart ass comments because I have tinkered with my games for at least 15 years.

[TDK1044]

Hell hath no fury like a modder scorned. :D

[Alex]

I've never really understood the unnecessary tension between Silent Hunter III and Silent Hunter IV on the subject of modding.
Because everyone on the SH3 side is ignorant.

But for some people, if its not Uboats with GWX stenciled on it, it doesnt exist. If ignorance is bliss, theres some really happy folks out there.

Wasn't my intention to be so blunt, but i guess your right, thats what i was saying. So, i might as well step up to the plate..

yes, theres a lot of ignorance coming from the SH3 folks.

1.) This whole "I like one side and the other is a bunch of crap" mentality is old, and gets on everyones nerves. I sometimes cope the same attitude back, but only as a response to the original prodding.

2.) In relation to point 1, a lot of people here play uboats exclusively, and are too ignorant to "Expand their horizons" (:roll: ). They'll talk a lot of smack about something they know nothing about. Personally, i didn't want to play another uboat game in SH3, but i got informed on it anyway. I probably know as much about uboats as i do about fleetboats (if not moreso). I can't say others here on subsim are as open minded.

3.) Comments like "the modding hasn't taken off yet", In any context, get on alot of peoples nerves as well. Particuarlly when youve spent 4 or 5 hours on the game every night, or every other night, for months now. The proof that the modding has taken off is in the work thats been published, the highlights are too numberous to list. Right now im sitting on two updates to TM that i havent posted yet. When people imply nothing has been done for modding, the kneejerk reaction is "hmm gee, WTF have i been doing for months now?!"

Which i guess leads into another point. Bragging. For the most part, folks don't do too much of that here. At least, not in a fashion to say, "look how much better my mod is over the other ones!". The modding community here is not the cutthroat compedative world that SH3's was, (or is? :hmm: ), but an open source, collaborative effort. So your not going to see a whole lot of , "Sneak peek" posts.


At any rate, im tired of all this. I dont expect the ignorance level to change here anytime soon. So all im trying to do now, is finish my work so i can back away from all of this crap. I'll have my game that ive been waiting 12 years for, and to me, thats all that matters in the end - not the typical subsim.com school yard antics.
Mate, with all due respect... Please, and it's almost a prayer... Grow up.

You do not like GWX because you do not appreciate the Kapitän... Good (though not appreciating the expansion just because you don't like one and only person is... a bit childish :roll:). But please, KEEP THIS STORY FOR YOU NOW ! People have nothing to do with what happened to you. Not that people is not interested in reading what you think of GWX... But STOP LIVING IN THE PAST. You are strongly against GWX, nice. But do you think that's what's going to make us move to the pacific, or to make us leave Subsim ?
I don't think so, Ducimus.
Now, if you do not grow up, please, at least stop being unpleasant. It only shows one and only thing, unfortunately : that you still are a child and that you can not handle the presence of GWX/the GWX guys staying silent.

You're tired of all this. You couldn't even handle to see a Type VII intact, you prefer them damaged and destroyed... Ok, good. But being there is a right we all have. Please, be a man... And bear with it. You 've already told everybody that you want to finish your work on SH4, then you'll leave Subsim... You have left Subsim, don't know how many times. And you've always been back... So please, stop being rude to us/GWX.

Now, concerning the red part... I do not agree. We simply are interested in the Kriegsmarine too much to fall in love with the U.S. Navy actually, no more. What I mean is that lots of SH3 players play SH4 as well (don't have a computer able to run it myself, do I still need to mention it ? :88) ), but they don't feel as much "concerned" sailing the Pacific as the Atlantic ocean. That's all. We Atlantic lovers respect the U.S. Navy as much as we respect the Kriegsmarine.

Also... Feel at home here, everybody does... But remember that we do not force you to visit the u-boat missions section of Subsim. ;)

Zee ju ! :88) :p

Respectfully,


Alex

[Uber Gruber]

a lot of people here play uboats exclusively, and are too ignorant to "Expand their horizons"


Sorry Ducimus mate but thats just a "pants" comment. I like what you did with TM and said so, I also liked what you did over at SH3 and said so then. But for the life of me I have no idea why you keep stepping up to the plate, make an announcement that irks people and then announce you're leaving subsim for good when someone questions your tack. Thankfiully though you always return and I for one am always very pleased when you do cos your modding work is top notch stuff. But PLEASE dont have a go at people because they prefer the U-Boats and the atlantic campaign.....you go nuts when someone even makes a jocular comment re Fleet Boats and the Pacific Campaign...so the words kettle, pot and silly spring to mind.

Thanks.

[Jimbuna]

a lot of people here play uboats exclusively, and are too ignorant to "Expand their horizons"


Sorry Ducimus mate but thats just a "pants" comment. I like what you did with TM and said so, I also liked what you did over at SH3 and said so then. But for the life of me I have no idea why you keep stepping up to the plate, make an announcement that irks people and then announce you're leaving subsim for good when someone questions your tack. Thankfiully though you always return and I for one am always very pleased when you do cos your modding work is top notch stuff. But PLEASE dont have a go at people because they prefer the U-Boats and the atlantic campaign.....you go nuts when someone even makes a jocular comment re Fleet Boats and the Pacific Campaign...so the words kettle, pot and silly spring to mind.

Thanks.

This is one of the best posts I have seen on SS in a while :rock:

You sir are to be complemented on your sensible, balanced and adult like response to such.....Oh never mind....bettter I don't sink to the same depth of ignorance and stupidity of a certain individual :nope:

[Jimbuna]

I forgot to mention I have reported #34

[Ducimus]

*yawn* Typical GWX forum campaign when someone says something they don't like. Fine report me. I didnt say anything to you at all, you just dont like what i said. Truth be told, you jackels are looking for ANY reason to get rid of me, so you'll jump on any opportunity to do so. The thing is - i don't care.

[Dowly]

*yawn* Typical GWX forum campaign when someone says something they don't like. Fine report me. I didnt say anything to you at all, you just dont like what i said.

Doesnt this apply to you too when someone is saying something you dont like about the Fleetboats? :88)

[CaptainHaplo]

Aww cmon..... first we get a rant of "Ducimus just doesnt like GWX" then we get well "Now I am gonna tell on you!". Ok this is getting out of hand. Lets all take a deep breath. Whatever history Ducimus and the GWX team have (and thankfully I neither know it nor care too), I don't know that Ducimus has ever stated he didn't like GWX. I would be willing to bet, given how much of others work he has used and adapted, that he isn't to proud to say someone besides himself did something good or well. GWX is heavily respected for SH3 - for good reason. It is an excellent mod, regardless of any single person's opinion. More importantly, whether he, or anyone else, likes GWX (or its mod team) doesnt have a thing to do with the topic. So let the past be the past.

If ya don't, expect the thread to be closed, and a decent discussion on the what ifs be closed with it. And with that said I take some measure of responsibility for starting this whole mess with my initial post, for which I offer a sincere apology to all.

With that said, it seems like there may be a major project to move sh4 capability back eastward. For those interested in such a thing, that would be grand. Perhaps there will be some announcement soon from those that know what is planned. And in the meantime, there is nothing stopping anyone from taking on the challenge of creating their own "atlantic mod". The tools needed are there, and the who to in the mod forum is a great place to start for a person or team that wants to form and attempt it.

[Alex]

Ducimus, mate... Please stop saying this, you're making a fool of yourself... Do you sincerely think that you are the center of the world to us ? :oops:

[Dowly]

With that said, it seems like there may be a major project to move sh4 capability back eastward. For those interested in such a thing, that would be grand. Perhaps there will be some announcement soon from those that know what is planned. And in the meantime, there is nothing stopping anyone from taking on the challenge of creating their own "atlantic mod". The tools needed are there, and the who to in the mod forum is a great place to start for a person or team that wants to form and attempt it.

GWX for SHIV is in the works already (Kpt.Lehmann mentioned it in the SHIII forums). No idea if it will be an Atlantic mod or Indian Ocean, or both, but he also said that there will be less announcements from them than was with SHIII's GWX.

[GlobalExplorer]

If ya don't, expect the thread to be closed, and a decent discussion on the what ifs be closed with it. And with that said I take some measure of responsibility for starting this whole mess with my initial post, for which I offer a sincere apology to all.

Yeah I also feel bad about making my - general - statements about modding in a thread that quickly turned into a shootout about things that seem to go very deep. Had I know that before I would like to move my statements in another thread were we discuss problems and not about people.

So as I said, take it easy lads, or - as Thomsen said in das Boot - "Ruhe Im Puff!" ;)

[FloydRoses]

WOW,What a MASS!!!....this post originally oriented to a Atlantic SH4 wolves,is turned of a guerrilla post.:hmm:

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Guys, I'm only going to say this once. I'm not going to tolerate modder flamewars in this forum, regardless of the wrappings they're in. That doesnt mean I'm promoting them elsewhere, far from it. However, I do want to maintain a positive and friendly atmosphere here.

The only people Subsimmers should be targeting are the enemy ships.